OCD (obsessive compulsive disorder) and Scrupulosity, Asexuality, false gay fears...

[Ameen]

Hello, everyone.

The issue of OCD (obsessive-compulsive disorder) came up in another thread, and since people here may suffer from Scrupulosity, the religious form of OCD, and may have gotten involved with extremist religion because of it (as I did), I want to make it a new thread.

Before I talk about full-blown OCD, let me make it clear that the bulk of you DO NOT have it even if you have some OCD-like traits. Everyone is a little of everything (OCD, bipolar, ADHD, and so on). The difference between being a little of something and having an anxiety disorder like OCD has a lot to do with the quality of one's life. With full-blown OCD, thoughts, behaviors, and fears interfere too much with one's happiness, productivity, work, interactions with others, and so on.

Also, every first-year med or psych student self-diagnoses with just about everything. If you think you have OCD or anything else, please get a professional opinion. I am neither an M.D. not a psychologist, and, sadly, I cannot make a diagnosis or treat symptoms. I can, however, answer as many questions as you wish--and will do so gladly.

First, here is the quickie definition of Scrupulosity, which I have already posted in another thread. If you read it there you need not also read it here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scrupulosity

For those who want more information... Here is a link to longer, excellent (reader-friendly!) article on Scrupulosity ("God Forbid") by Steven Phillipson, Ph.D., Clinical Director of The Center for Cognitive-Behavioral Psychotherapy. It will clarify exactly what Scrupulosity is.

http://www.ocdonline.com/articlephillipson10.php

In addition, since many of you are Christians and I am not, here is what Monnica A. Williams, a behavior therapist and conservative Christian I know personally and deeply respect, wrote:

http://www.brainphysics.com/ocdchristian2.php

Monnica's article appears on the Brainphysics OCD board, which she owns and operates. It is on that board that I do what I can for people with a form of OCD known on the Internet (only) as HOCD (Homosexual OCD) and off the Internet as sexual obsessions (which includes many types of OCD and not just what we call HOCD on the Internet).

Many Christians also suffer from this form of OCD since the sexual obessions that plague them run counter to their beliefs. It is important to realize that these Christians are not evil and that they did not choose to have OCD. It is an illness with symptoms like any other illness with symptoms, not something people bring on themselves and not some form of divine punishment. One definition of OCD is "intrusive, unwanted thoughts"--in other words, not thoughts the sufferer consciously chooses to have.

Sexual obsession explained on Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_obsessions

OCD can interfere so badly with a person's life that he or she may become unable to function. Even people who remain functional (as I did) may spend years in a living mental hell (again, as I did).

Back to HOCD specifically... For the heterosexuals (Christian and non-Christian) who get it, it presents as 24/7 false fears about being gay with high anxiety, physiological reactions, fears triggered simply by seeing an attractive person of the same sex, inability to enjoy things that once brought pleasure, and so on. Gays who get it falsly fear that they are heterosexual, bisexuals falsely fear that they are attracted to only one sex (usually not the one they are currently with)...

Like all forms of OCD, it cannot be explained away by logic or, short of divine intervention, erased by prayer and religious devotion. If we OCD sufferes could simply stop it on our own, OCD would not be the nightmare it is. I can be a very vindictive person, but I would not wish any form of OCD on my worst enemy.

If you want a full explanation of HOCD, here is the article that I wrote in 2005 per Monnica's request ("I'm Gay and You're Not: Understanding Homosexuality Fears"). It also appears on Brainphysics:

http://www.brainphysics.com/yourenotgay.php

I have never had this type of OCD, as my issues focus on Scrupulosity and natural disasters. Nevertheless, since this issue is so misunderstood and since those with HOCD literally don't know where to turn, I do all I can to help. I spend the bulk of my Internet time either working with my ESL students (nothing related to OCD) or answering 12+ long private messages a week from panicky OCD people--most of them heterosexual and more than half of them Christian males in their teens and early twenties. (You see how long winded I am--an OCD trait?--so you know that my responses are just as long.)

If anyone has false fears about being gay, being transgendered, being a pedophile, and so on, feel free to join the Brainphysics board. There are Christians there--and also atheists, Jews, Muslims, Wiccans...

http://www.neuroticplanet.com/forum/

About 95% of Brainphysics posts are about false gay fears and other sexual issues.

I post there as Mark. My real name is Mark-Ameen Johnson, but I prefer Ameen (which is why I use it here). Ameen speaks to my Arab heritage; the rest of my name does not.

Be warned that I in particular am very, very graphic, as I often talk about human sexuality, fetishes, masturbation, erections, stimulation, and so on in detail so that people will see that their fears have no basis in reality. Once again, I cannot diagnose or treat OCD since I am neither a therapist nor an M.D. However, as a gay man with OCD, I can tell them what homosexuality is and is not--and what OCD is. My goal is to get sufferers to see that this is an OCD problem and not a sexual orientation problem--and to help them find the right sort of help (behavior therapy with exposure exercises administered by a behavior therapist who knows about or specializes in OCD and, if necessary, medication).

Some are so distraught that they have attempted suicide, taken illegal drugs, engaged in same-sex sexuality even though they are not gay, think they are being punished by God, and so on.

If anyone is interested in why behavior therapy and NOT Freudian psychoanalysis is best for OCD, here is Monnica's article:

http://www.brainphysics.com/therapy.php

If you suffer from Scrupulosity or other forms of OCD (germ phobia, false fears about harming people you love, ROCD--relationship OCD or false fears about love for/from your spouse or whether he/she is faithful, etc.) instead of or in addition to sexual issues/false gay fears, there are many other boards out there. And we do have a section for other OCD issues on Brainphysics as well.

May I suggest Stuck in a Doorway, which is based in the UK but also includes many Americans, Canadians, Australians, and people in non-English speaking countries?

http://www.stuckinadoorway.co.uk/

I am not on this board, but I have heard many good things from the Brainphysics crowd. (The Brainphysics crowd is also international, by the way.)

Finally--since it is the other issue I deal with, although not on Brainphysics--if anyone here is asexual or seeks to understand asexuality (neither heterosexual nor homosexual nor bisexual--no sex drive), here is my article on it, written from the perspective of a sexual person:

http://www.asexuality.org/home/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=45&Itemid=38

If I can use my volunteer work to make a contribution here in exchange for discussing the religious abuse I suffered, I would be happy to do so.

Questions and comments are welcome.

All the best,

Ameen

[Ameen]

Forgot this one and the board won't let me add it to the original post since 15 minutes have passed...

From the Obsessive Compulsive Foundation (in the U.S.)... "How Do I Know If My Therapist Can Treat Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD)?"

http://www.ocfoundation.org/UserFiles/File/How-to-Choose-a-Therapist.pdf


--Ameen

[Willow]

You're great Ameen. I'm so glad you came here.
It's opened a whole new realm of exploration for me. AA and pastoral counseling weren't of much help for me so far. I did get DXed OCD and PTSD a long long time ago and had to stop therapy almost immediately after diagnosis due to loss of my job. Anyway... I have just started therapy again and am going to bring up scrupulosity. I've done a bit of my own exposure therapy by being naughty and going against the channels dug in my own brain. Unfortunately, AA participation has driven me back into some of my old patterns. I thought it would help... but now am considering a different direction due to torturing thoughts of right/wrong and the rigidness that is all too familiar from my cult years. Thanks again!

Willow

[Willow]

Ameen... I was wondering if being an approval addict is part of the OCD? I check often with others to make sure I'm not doing anything wrong. I think it's based on a fear of rejection. The more affirmation I get, the happier I am.

[JaniceB]

Ameen,
I've been off the forum for a few days so I didn't get in on your interesting threads until today. Welcome aboard. You sound like one of us to a large extent. I happen to be a Christian in the religious sense this week but that's changed before and could change again.

I sure wish I could find someone like you in the Seattle area. I have a kid with Tourette's and OCD and he could use a mentor or something. But if I suggested it he would balk. It's so hard to deal with! I love him but he's 32 and I have to let it all go.

I'm a writer too. I've written a novel called "Tomato Blossoms" which is available on www.lulu.com. Check it out!

I've been a member of a twelve-step group for many years and I have met many recovering people who are atheists and many who are gay and some who are both. I learn from them all so I am glad you've joined us. You have a different perspective and that's a good thing.

[Ameen]

Also sent as a private message with different wording:

Dear Jerry,

Please, please, please unlock my initial "gay atheist seeking..." thread. You wrote that it was locked only because this thread seemed a duplicate of it; however, my threads are nothing alike. I can understand why you would think they were, though.

This OCD thread was started with Willow in mind--and also so that others who need information about OCD can find it. It isn't for me to get help; it's for others. This is what I do in my volunteer work, and I said I was willing to do it here in exchange for getting help.

My original thread is for me to talk and get help. If you close that, then there is no reason for me to be on this board.

In addition, the threads are clearly labelled "OCD" and "gay atheist seeking..." There should be no confusion.

I can ask that people only post about OCD in this thread. Advice for me goes in the "gay atheist seeking..." thread.

In addition, I need to respond to the latest posts in my initial thread and cannot since it is locked. I am not fond of private messages, although I have just sent you one. Private messages have historically been a way for Christians to abuse me while remaining cloyingly sweet on a board. I would like anything said to me done in public. This is another reason I need a thread for me apart from private messages and helping others with OCD or asexual issues.

--------------------------------

@ Willow: Thank you for the kind words. It sounds to me like your need for approval may be a way to get OCD reassurance, which is the worst thing for OCD since it strengthens it. If, for example, you obsess about a specific horrible event that you fear is going to happen even though there is no evidence to support it (like, for example, my OCD obsession with earthquakes and hurricanes), seeking reassurance from others that it will not occur only makes you fear it will happen even more. The same is true of any research you do or mental arguments you pose--what we call "checking" in OCD circles.

The goal of CBT (cognitive behavior therapy) and exposures and is to make you stop freaking out over these unpleasant thoughts and to just ignore them. OCD people want absolute certainty, but life = uncertainty. Another goal of CBT is to learn to live with uncertainty.

Of course, you cannot do that overnight. Three techniques that work for me:

1. Changing OCD What Ifs into What If Nots (or OCD What If Nots into What Ifs). For example, "What if people hate me?" becomes "What if people do not hate me?" "What if I have just XXXXX?" becomes "What if I have not XXXXXX?" "What if they don't approve of me?" becomes "What if they approve of me?"

2. Laugh at the stupidity of your OCD dilemmas. Remember that they are based on illogic, not logic. Logic cannot win with OCD no matter how sound it is; OCD is called "the doubting disease" for a reason. One of the many young people I write to on Brainphysics once told me that he looked at himself naked in the mirror, saw his penis, yet doubted that he was a male. The obvious proof was staring him in the face, yet he couldn't accept it. That's the way OCD works. It makes you doubt things you absolutely know to be true.

In the book Brain Lock (my favorite OCD book), Dr. Schwartz tells of a man who was afraid to touch his wife and baby for fear of hurting or even killing them with the knives attached to his fingers. Of course, there were no knives, and this man could see that there were no knives. But OCD made him doubt the evidence before his eyes--and even when Dr. Schwartz told him there were no knives he still doubted it.

Do you see how OCD works? That's why you have these issues. The key: "It isn't me. It's my OCD."

By the way, the young man on Brainphysics has been free of the bulk of his OCD symptoms (which also included false gay fears that left him paralyzed with fear) for about two years now. He says hello by private message every six months or so, and he currently has a girlfriend and enjoys a sex life with her. That would have been impossible when he was stuck in OCD terror. The man in Brain Lock also got better. Behavior therapy and, when necessary, medication work. That's the route they took and the route I took. I am no longer in therapy, but I need Zoloft. However, I only take 25% of what I once took.

Do you see how ridiculous their issues were? That's how ridiculous all OCD issues, including yours and mine, are. So laugh at it even when the issues cause you tremendous pain.

All that being said, people with OCD only or who have suffered spiritual abuse only often have low self-esteem and need more stroking than most. This is not necessarily an OCD symptom, but rather a result of life issues apart from OCD rumination. The trick is learning to tell when it is obsessing and when it is not--and that is not something you can learn overnight.

Be patient. There is life--GOOD LIFE--despite OCD.

3. Agree with OCD even though you know it's wrong. You are agreeing only to disarm it, as fighting it, no matter how logical your arguments, only strengthens it. So, approval... Say something like... "That's right, no one approves of me. I'm the biggest scum on the earth, and no one would want me even if I were the last woman left alive. Everything I do is a failure. I'll never amount to anything." Again, you are not saying this because you believe it; rather, you need to give your mind a rest from OCD's warfare.

@ JaniceB: Thank you so much for the kind words, but perhaps only the part about Tourette's and OCD should go in this thread. The other things should go in the other thread (if it is reopened).

I'll GLADLY check out your book when I get a chance and comment on it in the other thread.

I agree that different perspectives are good, which is why I think I can learn a lot here. In addition, being here is behavior therapy for me, as I don't have a high opinion of Christians but wish to learn to separate the individual from the belief system.

Your son... We OCD folks can be incredibly stubborn. Speaking as a male, it is hard to admit that there is something in us that we cannot take charge of and control. No matter how liberated and/or feminist we are--and I am a staunch feminist--there's something about testosterone that makes us feel we must be the master of all and let the world know it. Admitting that I needed help ran contrary to my biological programming and took a lot out of me. (You know the old joke about how a man will never ask for directions...)

In my opinion (only), the best thing for your son is to join an OCD board where he feels comfortable or read some OCD self-help books. (As I told Willow, Brain Lock by Dr. Jeffery Schwartz is my favorite.) By being on a board with folks his age, he may come to the conclusion that seeking help is a good thing. If other guys do it and remain alpha males, so can he. OCD self-help books can get him started, and almost all of them suggest getting help and have a list of resources.

If his OCD is mild, a self-help book is all he needs. Moderate OCD requires behavior therapy and often but not always medication. Severe OCD requires both.

Hope that helps.

If I can share anything else that will help either of you or anyone else, please don't hesitate to ask. Again, this is what I do.

Ameen

[Ameen]

@ Jerry: This is a continuation of my last post in this thread. I would simply add it to the previous one, but 15 minutes have already passed and I cannot.

Here's a solution to the problem. As a moderator, you can rename this thread. Why not simply call this one "OCD (obsessive-compulsive disorder)" and nothing more. Or perhaps--"How OCD (obsessive-compulsive disorder) may be important to people recovering from spiritual abuse."

That way, people will not confuse it with my "Openly gay atheist looking for..." (not "seeking," as I wrote in the previous message) thread.

[Ameen]

Thank you, Jerry, for reopening the thread! :) :cool:

Now that I have been totally OCD in obsessively seeking to get it reopened ( :o ), let's go back to any questions other may have about OCD, asexuality, or other self-help issues.

[Willow]

It's really odd that you brought up asexuality... I was a virgin until I was 40. Part of my own therapy to myself was to break the perfect record. Smear the mud on the window so-to-speak. Now... I can't say that I am not heterosexual... but due to past childhood abuses and the strict moral code of the cult, I functioned as an asexual. Of course... this might not be a proper topic for this board... I don't know. I seem to overstep the boundaries of appropriate topics often here. I'm not sure how I do it. I finally just made a joke of it and try hard to not mess up and flame the board... LOL. Having my thread locked is the horror of horrors to me and I try to avoid it like the plague. It feels like rejection.

[Spiny Norman]

Re: the mention above of Cognitive Behaviour Therapy (CBT) ... about 12 months ago I bought myself a book on the subject (its a "Guide for the Practicing Clinician"). I plan on reading it over the next few weeks whilst I am away on holidays. Hopefully I will be able to apply some of the principles in it to myself.

[sharoosunidhi]

Hi.
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==================================
sharoo

Alcoholism Information (http://www.alcoholisminformation.org)

[Willow]

Hi sharoo... thanks for the link. It looks like a good information site on alcoholism.

[Jerry]

Having my thread locked is the horror of horrors to me and I try to avoid it like the plague. It feels like rejection.

Hehehehehehehehehe ;)

[Ameen]

Finally--since it is the other issue I deal with, although not on Brainphysics--if anyone here is asexual or seeks to understand asexuality (neither heterosexual nor homosexual nor bisexual--no sex drive), here is my article on it, written from the perspective of a sexual person:

http://www.asexuality.org/home/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=45&Itemid=38



After my departure from this board, I asked that the old link to my article on asexuality be changed to the new one. Unfortunately, it was not, and I do not know why.

Here is the new link for the article as it appears on the Aven asexuality board (in case someone here is asexual and needs to read such an article as part of the healing process). Like my article on OCD, it has been used by behavior therapists.

http://www.asexuality.org/home/node/21

The old link, copied in my quote on top of this post, will take you to one of the main pages on the Aven asexuality board, which is also useful. There is a forum on the board for those who wish to talk to other asexuals.

In reason,

Ameen

[Ameen]

MODERATOR:

Please edit the part of my post that called Monnica Williams a conservative Christian. It should simply read "Christian." Although I have not posted here or visited this board since 2008, it has come to my attention that someone misunderstood the part about "conservative Christian." As an atheist, I have my own definitions of "conservative Christian," but the term may be inaccurate when viewed by a practicing Christian. I do not want people to view Monnica in a way I did not intend because of differing definitions of "conservative Christian." She is sensitive to all types of faith.

--Ameen
Decemer 29, 2010