Trying To Make Sense of the Tsunami (CAUTION:SCRIPTURES)

[Reg]

John, here's the thread. I've struggled with this myself.

I know God is Love because of the scripture in 1 John 4:16. That chapter alone makes it very clear. And then what Christ did on the cross demonstrates it fully. You know the scriptures, "For God so loved then world.......etc"

So I searched the scriptures to see if there was something there that would clear it up for me.

I first want to put a disclaimer here: "This is just my humble opinon and I don't want anyone to think that this is the definitive answer. I'm just trying to make sense of it with what I know about God."

Let me go to a few scriptures to identify some other things I know for sure.

Ecc 9:11 ¶ I returned and saw under the sun that the race [is] not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, nor yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favor to men of skill; but time and chance happens to them all. (MKJV)

So this could help explain a bit but I was still not satisfied. I kept asking myself, why all these natural disasters? Is it just time and chance or is there another reason? What part does Satan play in this?

Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, the old serpent called Devil, and Satan, who deceives the whole world. He was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
Joh 12:31 Now is [the] judgment of this world. Now shall the prince of this world be cast out.
Joh 16:11 concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged. (MKJV)
Job 1:7 & 2:2 And the LORD said to Satan, From where do you come? Then Satan answered the LORD and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.

This one identifies Satan has power here and can work miracles.

2Thes 2:9 whose coming is according to the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
Re 13:14 And it deceives those dwelling on the earth, because of the miracles which were given to it to do before the beast, saying to those dwelling on the earth that they should make an image to the beast who had the wound by a sword and lived. (MKJV)

My question here is, "Could Satan cause earthquakes and hurricanes?"
If so, it would help me understand the tragedy more.

Eph 2:2 in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now works in the children of disobedience;

God protects His people.

1Sa 30:23 And David said, My brothers, you shall not do so with that which the LORD has given us. For He has protected us, and has delivered into our hand the company that came against us. (MKJV)
Ps 121:8 The LORD shall keep your going out and your coming in from this time forth, and even forevermore. (MKJV)
Ps 5:11 But let all who put their trust in You rejoice; let them always shout for joy, because You defend them. And let those who love Your name be joyful in You. (MKJV)

There are references where God hides His face because he is displeased with some people. This shows there are things that make Him angry.

2Kings 17:11 And they burned incense in all the high places, like the nations whom the LORD had removed from before them; and did evil things to provoke the LORD to anger. (MKJV)
2Ki 17:18 So the LORD was very angry with Israel, and turned them away from His face; not one was left, only the tribe of Judah by itself. (MKJV)
Deut 31:17 Then My anger shall be kindled against them in that day, and I will forsake them. And I will hide My face from them, and they shall be devoured, and many evils and troubles shall befall them, so that they will say in that day, Have not these evils come on us because our God [is] not among us? (MKJV)

That last part gives me a clue. One of the reasons those who have trouble is because God is not among them

That's my study to this point. If anyone else can add to this, I sure would be grateful.

I'll post here again if I come up with somethng else that makes sense.

[4trustful one]

Reg,

It is obvious to me that you have been thinking through the issue of suffering alot. Probably alot of us here have also. the very issue of suffering is so hard to make sense of.

A number of years after I became a Christiatn, due to an extremely dark time of my life, I told God that I hated Him. I was shocked at myself because I knew that "Christian's" were not supposed to be like that. I was full of so much hatred towards Him. I think that I was projecting upon Him the abuse that my dad had towards me. I realized then, that something was desperately wrong with my concept of God. I started my "search". It went on and I carried on - for several more years. Again due to prolonged abuse from someone else and abuse from my church, other evil things coming against me, etc. and terrible, terrible fear my heart got very cold towards God again. My search resumed for many more years.

to make a long story short, the answer that has helped me, perhaps the most is that I believe God is not angry at us. He is not displeased with us. But He weeps and becomes angry at what happens to us because of what others do towards us and because of what we allow in our lives. The bad things that happen are very offensive to Him. this is because He knows that we will ultimately be destroyed and He hates to see His precious creation destoyed. It comes across as Him being mad at us or displeased. He is never against us, I personally believe. But He hates evil because He knows that it will destroy us. An example is look what abuse from our churches has done to those recovering from spiritual abuse. Terrible things that people, in the name of Christianity, have done to us. Those things and the way some people have been to us have almost destoyed us. He weeps over what we go through.
Re: the Tsunami - I don't know. I believe it is what He allowed to show us what evil does to us; it desroys us. As many of us know..........Why some people had to suffer, I don't know. I do believe that is His longing, mercy call to those left behind.

These are just my opinions but they have brought me great peace.

Realizing that God is not mad at me!!! has brought tremendous freedom to me. :p

[Willow]

This may sound a bit crude... but my theology after the church abuse had to take a turn to the simplistic for the sake of my sanity. The new theology fits into two words succinctly: "Shit Happens". I believe there's a God and he should have control of the elements. However... I can't know his mind and have decided that it is best not to put such meanings on negative or positive events. One leads to shame and the other leads to pride. If I think God is smiling on me, I feel more approved of than others who are suffering. If I think God is punishing me, I feel less worthy than others and begin to get depressed. It's really hard for me to detach meaning from events... but when I can I do a lot better emotionally. The facts are... an underwater earthquake disturbed the water, rushing it outward. The severe damage and loss of life was the result. I wish I knew how to insert God into the phenomena in a productive way... but it's not possible for me to even understand on that level. I think I better stick to the stuff that is evidenced in regard to cause and effect. I hope this doesnt' sound simplistic. It's just how I have to look at it. I'm hoping it helps someone like it helps me.

[Savedbygrace]

This may sound a bit crude... but my theology after the church abuse had to take a turn to the simplistic for the sake of my sanity. The new theology fits into two words succinctly: "Shit Happens". I believe there's a God and he should have control of the elements. However... I can't know his mind and have decided that it is best not to put such meanings on negative or positive events.

Willow,
Well put. Ever since my own personal tragedies, this is the attitude I have come to share. Thanks for putting it into words.

Trish

[Reg]

Reg,

It is obvious to me that you have been thinking through the issue of suffering alot. Probably alot of us here have also. the very issue of suffering is so hard to make sense of.

to make a long story short, the answer that has helped me, perhaps the most is that I believe God is not angry at us. He is not displeased with us. But He weeps and becomes angry at what happens to us because of what others do towards us and because of what we allow in our lives. The bad things that happen are very offensive to Him. this is because He knows that we will ultimately be destroyed and He hates to see His precious creation destoyed. It comes across as Him being mad at us or displeased. He is never against us, I personally believe. But He hates evil because He knows that it will destroy us...........
Re: the Tsunami - I don't know. I believe it is what He allowed to show us what evil does to us; it destroys us. As many of us know..........Why some people had to suffer, I don't know. I do believe that is His longing, mercy call to those left behind.

These are just my opinions but they have brought me great peace.

Realizing that God is not mad at me!!! has brought tremendous freedom to me. :p
Yes, they have given me great peace also to come to understand the grace and mercy of God.

Ps 119:165 ¶ Great peace [is to] those who love Your law, and [there is] no stumbling block for them. (MKJV)

Now I know where it says in Isa 55:8....

Isa 55:8 For My thoughts [are] not your thoughts, nor your ways My ways, says the LORD.

However, we can know the mind of God as He speaks to us through His Spirit.

1Cor 2:16 For who has known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct Him? But we have the mind of Christ. (MKJV)

Joh 15:15 No longer do I call you servants, for the servant does not know what his master does. But I have called you friends, for all things that I have heard from My Father I have made known to you. (MKJV)

Joh 16:13 However, when He, the Spirit of Truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth. For He shall not speak of Himself, but whatever He hears, He shall speak. And He will announce to you things to come. (MKJV)

Eph 3:3 that by revelation He made known to me the mystery (as I wrote before in few words,
4 by which, when you read, you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

Here is another scripture that helps me a little more to see God much like 4trustful one. He is a lover of mankind. We are his creation He loves. This is not our world. The Prince of the power of the air is largely in charge of a lot of evil events and natural disasters? Although God could have prevented it, Satan still holds sway over many things on planet earth today.

Heb 2:8 You have subjected all things under his feet." For in order that He put all things under him, He did not leave anything not subjected. But now we do not see all things having been put under him. (MKJV)

So, I have some other thoughts about this but they most likely would be misunderstood here on a public forum. And that is all they are, my thoughts. Are they some things God's Spirit is inspiring my mind to see? I can't say for sure. Time will tell. One thing for sure, not only has this unprecedented event occured today for all of us to see and witness, it seems that the weather is becoming more and more unstable all the time. The 4 hurricanes that devastated Florida is another case. And then there is the record rainfalls in California and snow in the mountains out there, not to mention the terrible mudslides and floods. So, what it says to me is that Satan knows his time is short and is beginning to pull out all stops to destroy us.

Rev 12:12 ¶ Therefore rejoice, O heavens, and those tabernacling in them. Woe to the inhabitants of the earth and in the sea! For the Devil came down to you, having great wrath, knowing that he has but a little time. (MKJV)

Are we now witnessing these things? It seems so to me.

Mark 13:8 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there shall be earthquakes in different places, and there shall be famines and troubles. These things [are] the beginnings of sorrows. (MKJV)

In one way, I hate to see the devastation and it troubles me to see so many dead and dying, especially the children. Yet, the Bible is very clear that this was all prophesied to occur before Christ would return. So, that day is getting a lot nearer and in that I rejoice. Yet, it is a rejoicing with mixed emotions.

[4trustful one]

Thank you, Reg. You are a true blessing to this forum. So is everyone else - each in our own way and time. Thank you for taking the time to read my post carefully. It means so much to me........................ :o

[Reg]

Thank you, Reg. You are a true blessing to this forum. So is everyone else - each in our own way and time. Thank you for taking the time to read my post carefully. It means so much to me........................ :o
Thanks 4trustful one. You and the others here don't know how much of a blessing you are to me! :p