freedom seeker
02-07-2008, 11:36 AM
Jerry, I was going to post this in response to your post on the call from your "elder", but thought it best to start a new thread. This article is one of the best I have read on the misconfigured church system, and the false definitions given on church leadership.
This is only a portion of the article, (more like a short book), but gives a very good disseration on the confusion in the church going all the way back to the Romans. It is an EXCELLENT read.
The link to the entire article is at the bottom.
Elders
The Greek word translated elder by the KJV translators is Presbuteros.
According to W.E. Vine, Presbuteros is "an adjective, the comparative degree of presbus, an old man, an elder....of age, whether of the elder of two persons...the eldest...of a person advanced in life, a senior..."
How is it that the Greek adjective presbuteros, ("older" or "elderly") mysteriously became a noun, represented in the English text by two official sounding titles, i.e., presbyter and elder? Among 54 translators in the KJV panel, at least one of them should have known the difference between an adjective and a noun.
They changed the translation of the Greek word presbuteros, which was formerly translated priest by the papacy, to elder, Tyndale's translation of the word. They did, however, do all that was within their power to give the term elder the same priestly and hierarchical connotation.
In his book entitled The Royal Priesthood, Carl Ketcherside exposes this conspiracy, revealing how the Catholic Church, through sophistry, sought to make presbuteros (elder) into a priestly office, aloof from the rest of the believers.
"The original word which is mistranslated "priests" by the Roman Catholic version is the Greek "presbuteros" which literally means "an aged person." The word for priest is "hiereus." Nothing can be more palpably misleading than the deliberate translation of a word to justify a practice; thus changing the Bible to suit a human system, rather than changing such a system to suit the Bible. To prove this grave charge I cite the very book of Acts, from which Dr. O'Brien quotes. There were both "priests" and "elders" among the Jews. Since Rome translates the word "presbuteros" (an aged man) by the term priests in Acts 14:22, what does she do when the words for both "priests" and "elders" occur in the same verse? Notice the Douay Version at Acts 6:23: "And being let go, they came to their own company, and related all that the chief priests (archiereis) and ancients (presbuteroi) had said to them." In Acts 23:14, the Douay Version reads: "Who came to the chief priests (archiereusin) and the ancients (presbuterois)." In Acts 25:15, "When I was at Jerusalem, the chief priests, and the ancients of the Jews, came unto me." Why did the translators from the Latin Vulgate not render the above by "chief priests and priests"? They knew that it was obvious that there were both priests and elders among the Jews, and an arbitrary translation of priests for "presbuteros" would be easily detected. Therefore they translated it by the word "ancients," which can be and is used in both an official and non-official sense in the New Covenant scriptures. Why then did theynot translate Acts 14:22 in conformity with their translation elsewhere, to read: "And when they had ordained to them ancients in every church, they commended them to the Lord in whom they believed"? Rome had to get her priestcraft in, even if she violated all laws of interpretation and forfeited all claims to consistency. Of such fragile, fanciful tissue is the great fabric of priestcraft woven."
The difference between the orthodox model of leadership today and the first century model is that one says, Do as I say, while the other said, "Do as I do." One is positional and the other is relational. The world is starving for examples; people are desperately looking for heroes, someone to show them the way. The first century elderly understood that the only power they possessed to influence others was the power of love and of their example. Perhaps you are asking, but doesn't the Bible say that elders are responsible to rule OVER the flock?
It is amazing how much one little word can change the meaning of a passage of scripture. Such is the case with this word over. Take for instance, Paul's words to the Ephesian elders in Acts 20:28 which reads,
"Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over (en) which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood."
This is a deliberate mistranslation. It could be nothing else for it required that the simplest Greek preposition, en (in or among), which is used 2,700 times in the New Testament and is nowhere else translated over, should be translated over only here and that in the context of leadership.
Peter instructed the presbuteros of his day regarding the nature of their work, reminding them of the perimeters set by the Lord Himself.
"Neither as being lords over (katakurieuo) God's heritage, but being ensamples to the flock." (1Peter 5:3)
The Greek word katakurieuo translated lords over in the above passage is a compound verb consisting of kata, down, and Kurieuo, to exercise lordship. Katakurieuo describes how a lord typically relates to a minion. He relates down (kata) because he is thought to be above or over. It is certain that Peter was remembering the words of Christ, who said "You know that the rulers of the Gentiles lord it over (katakurieuo) them … It shall not be so among you…" Jesus forbids His followers to lord-down upon each other. Instead, he reminds us that he who would be great must be a servant and whoever would be first must be a slave, even as the Son of man came not to be served but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many. (See Matthew 20:25-28)
In his commentary on 1 Peter 5:3, William Macdonald wrote,
"Elders should be examples, not dictators. They should be walking out in front of the flock, not driving them from behind. They should not treat the flock as if it belonged to them. This strikes at the very heart of authoritarianism! Many of the abuses in Christendom would be eliminated by simply obeying the three instructions in verses 2, 3. The first would abolish all reluctance. The second would spell the end of commercialism. The third would be the death of officialism in the church."
The first century presbuterion were the elderly who followed in Christ's example of servanthood and were recognized (See Philippians 3:17). These men were not lords over or controllers of God’s heritage. They were, "…examples becoming (ginomai) the flock…"(Morris Literal Translation). Ginomai is the Greek word from which we get our English word generate. It is a primary verb, meaning to cause to be ("gen"-erate) or bring into being. Ginomai speaks of the power of example, the power to energize and inspire what they modeled. What we are talking about is the power of a life laid down. "Greater love has no man than this," and as sacrifice begets greater sacrifice, the body of Christ is energized toward greater and greater service. This is the example Jesus left us. He came to serve. Not to receive service as a king, but to give service as a slave. In this up-side-down kingdom, there is no thought of ruling over another; no thought of promotion, for if the King came as a servant, what then are we to do?
Have you ever known someone who so inspired your admiration, that you caught yourself taking on their manners, their gestures, even talking like they talk? What you experienced, for good or bad, was the life altering power of an example.
When I, Michael, was a young man, my aunt pointed out to me one day that I laughed and smiled like my dad. One day in my adolescent years I even caught myself walking like he did. That was strange, because my father had an artificial leg that made him walk with a slight limp.
If Jesus, the ultimate example, the one who is altogether lovely, the one who suffered the horrors of Calvary on your behalf, should stand before you right now, you would become like him. You could not do otherwise. For it is in seeing Him that we are transformed. The scriptures say that when He appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is (2 Corinthians 3:18). When the power (Ginomai) of example is gone, all you have left is the tyranny of demanded conformity.
Because the true church is relational, not institutional, it makes sense only in a social context, a family context. In every truly healthy family, there is second and third generation communion. You have the grandchildren, the parents, and the grandparents. In that context, the grandparents are the elders. They possess the wisdom of years, and if godly, are in a position to teach by their words and example as no other family member can. Satan has done all he can possibly do to destroy the very concept of family, and to encourage the young in disrespect for the elderly, ignoring their counsel. Thus, we have witnessed the breakdown of the family and the church. The church is a family. It began in the heart of a loving Father who sent his only Son to bring many sons to glory. Oh, what manner of love the father has bestowed upon us that we should be called the sons of God!
http://www.awildernessvoice.com/GEC.html
This is only a portion of the article, (more like a short book), but gives a very good disseration on the confusion in the church going all the way back to the Romans. It is an EXCELLENT read.
The link to the entire article is at the bottom.
Elders
The Greek word translated elder by the KJV translators is Presbuteros.
According to W.E. Vine, Presbuteros is "an adjective, the comparative degree of presbus, an old man, an elder....of age, whether of the elder of two persons...the eldest...of a person advanced in life, a senior..."
How is it that the Greek adjective presbuteros, ("older" or "elderly") mysteriously became a noun, represented in the English text by two official sounding titles, i.e., presbyter and elder? Among 54 translators in the KJV panel, at least one of them should have known the difference between an adjective and a noun.
They changed the translation of the Greek word presbuteros, which was formerly translated priest by the papacy, to elder, Tyndale's translation of the word. They did, however, do all that was within their power to give the term elder the same priestly and hierarchical connotation.
In his book entitled The Royal Priesthood, Carl Ketcherside exposes this conspiracy, revealing how the Catholic Church, through sophistry, sought to make presbuteros (elder) into a priestly office, aloof from the rest of the believers.
"The original word which is mistranslated "priests" by the Roman Catholic version is the Greek "presbuteros" which literally means "an aged person." The word for priest is "hiereus." Nothing can be more palpably misleading than the deliberate translation of a word to justify a practice; thus changing the Bible to suit a human system, rather than changing such a system to suit the Bible. To prove this grave charge I cite the very book of Acts, from which Dr. O'Brien quotes. There were both "priests" and "elders" among the Jews. Since Rome translates the word "presbuteros" (an aged man) by the term priests in Acts 14:22, what does she do when the words for both "priests" and "elders" occur in the same verse? Notice the Douay Version at Acts 6:23: "And being let go, they came to their own company, and related all that the chief priests (archiereis) and ancients (presbuteroi) had said to them." In Acts 23:14, the Douay Version reads: "Who came to the chief priests (archiereusin) and the ancients (presbuterois)." In Acts 25:15, "When I was at Jerusalem, the chief priests, and the ancients of the Jews, came unto me." Why did the translators from the Latin Vulgate not render the above by "chief priests and priests"? They knew that it was obvious that there were both priests and elders among the Jews, and an arbitrary translation of priests for "presbuteros" would be easily detected. Therefore they translated it by the word "ancients," which can be and is used in both an official and non-official sense in the New Covenant scriptures. Why then did theynot translate Acts 14:22 in conformity with their translation elsewhere, to read: "And when they had ordained to them ancients in every church, they commended them to the Lord in whom they believed"? Rome had to get her priestcraft in, even if she violated all laws of interpretation and forfeited all claims to consistency. Of such fragile, fanciful tissue is the great fabric of priestcraft woven."
The difference between the orthodox model of leadership today and the first century model is that one says, Do as I say, while the other said, "Do as I do." One is positional and the other is relational. The world is starving for examples; people are desperately looking for heroes, someone to show them the way. The first century elderly understood that the only power they possessed to influence others was the power of love and of their example. Perhaps you are asking, but doesn't the Bible say that elders are responsible to rule OVER the flock?
It is amazing how much one little word can change the meaning of a passage of scripture. Such is the case with this word over. Take for instance, Paul's words to the Ephesian elders in Acts 20:28 which reads,
"Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over (en) which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood."
This is a deliberate mistranslation. It could be nothing else for it required that the simplest Greek preposition, en (in or among), which is used 2,700 times in the New Testament and is nowhere else translated over, should be translated over only here and that in the context of leadership.
Peter instructed the presbuteros of his day regarding the nature of their work, reminding them of the perimeters set by the Lord Himself.
"Neither as being lords over (katakurieuo) God's heritage, but being ensamples to the flock." (1Peter 5:3)
The Greek word katakurieuo translated lords over in the above passage is a compound verb consisting of kata, down, and Kurieuo, to exercise lordship. Katakurieuo describes how a lord typically relates to a minion. He relates down (kata) because he is thought to be above or over. It is certain that Peter was remembering the words of Christ, who said "You know that the rulers of the Gentiles lord it over (katakurieuo) them … It shall not be so among you…" Jesus forbids His followers to lord-down upon each other. Instead, he reminds us that he who would be great must be a servant and whoever would be first must be a slave, even as the Son of man came not to be served but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many. (See Matthew 20:25-28)
In his commentary on 1 Peter 5:3, William Macdonald wrote,
"Elders should be examples, not dictators. They should be walking out in front of the flock, not driving them from behind. They should not treat the flock as if it belonged to them. This strikes at the very heart of authoritarianism! Many of the abuses in Christendom would be eliminated by simply obeying the three instructions in verses 2, 3. The first would abolish all reluctance. The second would spell the end of commercialism. The third would be the death of officialism in the church."
The first century presbuterion were the elderly who followed in Christ's example of servanthood and were recognized (See Philippians 3:17). These men were not lords over or controllers of God’s heritage. They were, "…examples becoming (ginomai) the flock…"(Morris Literal Translation). Ginomai is the Greek word from which we get our English word generate. It is a primary verb, meaning to cause to be ("gen"-erate) or bring into being. Ginomai speaks of the power of example, the power to energize and inspire what they modeled. What we are talking about is the power of a life laid down. "Greater love has no man than this," and as sacrifice begets greater sacrifice, the body of Christ is energized toward greater and greater service. This is the example Jesus left us. He came to serve. Not to receive service as a king, but to give service as a slave. In this up-side-down kingdom, there is no thought of ruling over another; no thought of promotion, for if the King came as a servant, what then are we to do?
Have you ever known someone who so inspired your admiration, that you caught yourself taking on their manners, their gestures, even talking like they talk? What you experienced, for good or bad, was the life altering power of an example.
When I, Michael, was a young man, my aunt pointed out to me one day that I laughed and smiled like my dad. One day in my adolescent years I even caught myself walking like he did. That was strange, because my father had an artificial leg that made him walk with a slight limp.
If Jesus, the ultimate example, the one who is altogether lovely, the one who suffered the horrors of Calvary on your behalf, should stand before you right now, you would become like him. You could not do otherwise. For it is in seeing Him that we are transformed. The scriptures say that when He appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is (2 Corinthians 3:18). When the power (Ginomai) of example is gone, all you have left is the tyranny of demanded conformity.
Because the true church is relational, not institutional, it makes sense only in a social context, a family context. In every truly healthy family, there is second and third generation communion. You have the grandchildren, the parents, and the grandparents. In that context, the grandparents are the elders. They possess the wisdom of years, and if godly, are in a position to teach by their words and example as no other family member can. Satan has done all he can possibly do to destroy the very concept of family, and to encourage the young in disrespect for the elderly, ignoring their counsel. Thus, we have witnessed the breakdown of the family and the church. The church is a family. It began in the heart of a loving Father who sent his only Son to bring many sons to glory. Oh, what manner of love the father has bestowed upon us that we should be called the sons of God!
http://www.awildernessvoice.com/GEC.html