Reg
01-30-2008, 10:28 PM
Here is something I found about the Wilderness experience.
http://messiahrevealed.bravehost.com/wildernessword.html
I talked about it on this thread.
Out-of-church Christians
http://www.christianrecovery.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2511&highlight=wilderness
Excellent thread Michael.
Thanks so much for the link, I just finished reading it. What an eye-opener. Have you read it completely?
The part about the Church in the Wilderness in Chapter 7 was very revealing.
Here are some quotes from it.....
"When we look through the Scriptures we see that the wilderness is often a place of spiritual "crisis" and also preparation. It is the place God sends us before the "real action" begins - before we enter into the full purposes of God in our lives. There must be 'death' before there can be resurrection. There must be a desert place before the "promised land".".....
"Probably the best-known instance of a 'wilderness experience' in the Old Testament is the story of Moses and the children of Israel. There are some important lessons in this one as well. We all know the story. Moses had been raised and trained all his life in the palaces of Egypt. But when he came face-to-face with his heritage as an Israelite, he rose up "in his own strength" and killed an Egyptian slave-driver. He was then forced to flee into the desert, where he was to spend 40 YEARS as a simple shepherd in the wilderness. What an enormous length of time! Imagine if every Christian leader had to spend that long in the wilderness before God would allow them to lead His people! It is almost impossible to imagine the depths of despair and "death" to all his dreams and hopes that Moses went through during this time. In fact, after 40 years it is hard to imagine anyone being "deader" to the usual ambitions and temptations of leadership than Moses would have been. And what PATIENCE these years of waiting must have produced in him!
Again we see here the lengths that God will go to in the "preparation" phase of a leader. (-Though 40 years is unusually long). The isolation, the chafing, the crying out to God for deliverance - all play their part. Such an experience is almost irreplaceable. That is why God uses it so often. The hearts of driven men are so similar in so many ways, that God's "cure" becomes similar also! He will even shut us up in a kind-of 'prison' for a time so we cannot escape the process. It is that important. He does not want 'self'-oriented leaders shepherding his precious sheep."......
"It is important to remember that Jesus too went through a wilderness period just before His ministry began. As we all know, when he was baptized the Holy Spirit descended upon Him like a dove. "Then was Jesus led by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted by the devil" (Mt 4:1). This wilderness period was a time of testing and trial, of fasting for 40 days and nights, and of relentless attacks from the enemy. When Jesus had made it through to the other end, He was truly ready to begin His ministry. Thus, even in the life of the Savior of the world, the 'wilderness' was a crucial milestone."
"I began to notice that in the Book of Acts there were STRONG LEADERS (ie. apostles and elders) and a clear degree of ORGANIZATION AND STRUCTURE. I began to notice that there was discipline and authority (-bad words in much of the Out-of-church scene). And I realized that some of my Out-of-church attitudes had been "reactions" against the present system rather than accurate Biblical viewpoints.
So how do I view the 'Out-of-church' movement now? The fact is, I am still convinced that God is doing a preparation work in a lot of people, and so the wilderness is as important as ever. I also think that we are entering a great season of 'change' in the church. And "unlearning" the old ways to grasp hold of the new is something that God is obviously pushing. Many of the house-churches and cell-networks that are rising up are evidence of these winds of change. But there is a long way to go before we get back to the Christianity of the New Testament. This thing is only just beginning.
I am convinced that many of those who are being called out of the churches at this time have a leadership call upon their lives. In fact, I believe they may well be leaders in the coming move of God. As we have already noted, Alan Jamieson's studies revealed that a whopping 94% of the Out-of-church Christians he interviewed had been leaders of some kind in the church. That is a staggering statistic. I cannot help but think that God is about to do something new, and that He is preparing His leaders in the wilderness just as He has always done. It makes perfect sense and it is a thoroughly Scriptural concept, as we have seen."
That is something I noticed here. Most of us have many years of experience in one form or another in leadership. The braintrust here are hundreds if now thousands of years. By pooling our resourses with the help of the Holy Spirit, I also believe that we are being trained and prepared for future leadership in what God is doing in His Church.
Here is the link to The Goose thread. It is what a lot are doing now realizing the place they are in is toxic. It seems to be necessary to leave these toxic places into the wilderness to have our eyes of understanding opened to the truth. It seems this is where we are being prepared for future leadership.
http://www.christianrecovery.com/vb/...ighlight=goose
http://messiahrevealed.bravehost.com/wildernessword.html
I talked about it on this thread.
Out-of-church Christians
http://www.christianrecovery.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2511&highlight=wilderness
Excellent thread Michael.
Thanks so much for the link, I just finished reading it. What an eye-opener. Have you read it completely?
The part about the Church in the Wilderness in Chapter 7 was very revealing.
Here are some quotes from it.....
"When we look through the Scriptures we see that the wilderness is often a place of spiritual "crisis" and also preparation. It is the place God sends us before the "real action" begins - before we enter into the full purposes of God in our lives. There must be 'death' before there can be resurrection. There must be a desert place before the "promised land".".....
"Probably the best-known instance of a 'wilderness experience' in the Old Testament is the story of Moses and the children of Israel. There are some important lessons in this one as well. We all know the story. Moses had been raised and trained all his life in the palaces of Egypt. But when he came face-to-face with his heritage as an Israelite, he rose up "in his own strength" and killed an Egyptian slave-driver. He was then forced to flee into the desert, where he was to spend 40 YEARS as a simple shepherd in the wilderness. What an enormous length of time! Imagine if every Christian leader had to spend that long in the wilderness before God would allow them to lead His people! It is almost impossible to imagine the depths of despair and "death" to all his dreams and hopes that Moses went through during this time. In fact, after 40 years it is hard to imagine anyone being "deader" to the usual ambitions and temptations of leadership than Moses would have been. And what PATIENCE these years of waiting must have produced in him!
Again we see here the lengths that God will go to in the "preparation" phase of a leader. (-Though 40 years is unusually long). The isolation, the chafing, the crying out to God for deliverance - all play their part. Such an experience is almost irreplaceable. That is why God uses it so often. The hearts of driven men are so similar in so many ways, that God's "cure" becomes similar also! He will even shut us up in a kind-of 'prison' for a time so we cannot escape the process. It is that important. He does not want 'self'-oriented leaders shepherding his precious sheep."......
"It is important to remember that Jesus too went through a wilderness period just before His ministry began. As we all know, when he was baptized the Holy Spirit descended upon Him like a dove. "Then was Jesus led by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted by the devil" (Mt 4:1). This wilderness period was a time of testing and trial, of fasting for 40 days and nights, and of relentless attacks from the enemy. When Jesus had made it through to the other end, He was truly ready to begin His ministry. Thus, even in the life of the Savior of the world, the 'wilderness' was a crucial milestone."
"I began to notice that in the Book of Acts there were STRONG LEADERS (ie. apostles and elders) and a clear degree of ORGANIZATION AND STRUCTURE. I began to notice that there was discipline and authority (-bad words in much of the Out-of-church scene). And I realized that some of my Out-of-church attitudes had been "reactions" against the present system rather than accurate Biblical viewpoints.
So how do I view the 'Out-of-church' movement now? The fact is, I am still convinced that God is doing a preparation work in a lot of people, and so the wilderness is as important as ever. I also think that we are entering a great season of 'change' in the church. And "unlearning" the old ways to grasp hold of the new is something that God is obviously pushing. Many of the house-churches and cell-networks that are rising up are evidence of these winds of change. But there is a long way to go before we get back to the Christianity of the New Testament. This thing is only just beginning.
I am convinced that many of those who are being called out of the churches at this time have a leadership call upon their lives. In fact, I believe they may well be leaders in the coming move of God. As we have already noted, Alan Jamieson's studies revealed that a whopping 94% of the Out-of-church Christians he interviewed had been leaders of some kind in the church. That is a staggering statistic. I cannot help but think that God is about to do something new, and that He is preparing His leaders in the wilderness just as He has always done. It makes perfect sense and it is a thoroughly Scriptural concept, as we have seen."
That is something I noticed here. Most of us have many years of experience in one form or another in leadership. The braintrust here are hundreds if now thousands of years. By pooling our resourses with the help of the Holy Spirit, I also believe that we are being trained and prepared for future leadership in what God is doing in His Church.
Here is the link to The Goose thread. It is what a lot are doing now realizing the place they are in is toxic. It seems to be necessary to leave these toxic places into the wilderness to have our eyes of understanding opened to the truth. It seems this is where we are being prepared for future leadership.
http://www.christianrecovery.com/vb/...ighlight=goose