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View Full Version : Venting.. bad situation


Siobhanne
12-31-2004, 01:02 PM
I am upset about an e-mail I received from a church member that was intended to my husband. When I opened the e-mail, I didn't realize it was intended for him b/c it was not addressed to anyone... either him or me. At first, I thought it was a general letter written to more than one person. When I realized that it was for my husband specifically (his name was mentioned 3/4ths of the way through... I didn't stop reading. I know that was wrong. (which makes this situation even worse). It was sent to an address that only I use.. but is in my husbands name. The woman who sent this probably thought it WAS his address.

The e-mail was about a meeting awhile back. The meeting was held b/c many members have been upset with the way things were going and this meeting was supposed to allow people to voice their concerns and address the issues. Needless to say, the meeting was NOT well publicized. I did not know about it nor did I attend. Evidently my husband did attend and he didn't tell me. The e-mail came from a woman who is the secretary to the minister of pastoral care. In the email, she stated that she did not attend the meeting but heard that my husband had voiced concerns. She made some vague comments about people from outside the church were attacking, along with Satan and not to listen to them because they were trying to destroy God's church. Later in the e-mail, she made reference to prayer requests from one of my daughters and said that it was obvious that "church issues" had been discussed in the home. She went on to emphasize that the leaders were chosen by God and that we should submit to the authority of the leadership. ( I don't know what concerns my husband voiced at the meeting, but I do remember that the people in Jonestown submitted to the authority of their leadership and look what happened to them)

What I am thinking is that my husband was trying to use the critical thinking skills that God gave him.. and this was her attempt to nip it in the bud.

This woman had been my youngest (was 9 yrs old at the time) daughters former SS teacher a year ago. We pulled my child out of the class b/c my daughter was miserable (class out of control) and did not want to go back. We put her in another class at a different time, and she's been just fine since. We gave no explanation to the teacher other than we decided to make a change. This did not go over very well with this woman b/c we got a call about it. According to her, my child was a problem. I know the kid is not perfect.. I live with her but I do find it odd that everytime we inquired.. the answer was always the same... "Oh, she is the sweetest child"..until we pull her out.. and the story inexplicably changes?

I'm not sure what exactly gave this woman the indication that 'church business" had been discussed in our home with our children ( and yes, it had been discussed w/ my older children) My youngest child is 10, and many things go over her head. I don't know if it was something she said in class last year or not. My other children are teenagers (15 and 16) and yes, I've discussed the church problems with them. They are directly affected by the abuse and have asked some very valid questions. Yes, I answered them by pulling out my Bible and showing them what the Bible says... and asked them to consider whether or not that is what our church is teaching.

In our service, they ask people to write down prayer requests on the back of information cards and put them in the offering plates. The idea is that the staff will pray over them. It makes me feel very uncomfortable to think that one of my daughters naively put in a very genuine request about the situation that is troubling her, and have it dealt with like this. I also feel like this woman is trying to put a wedge between me and my husband and children. I feel totally alone in my marriage b/c intimate spiritual concerns I share with my husband are filtered through "chult members" whether I like it or not. I'm the outsider that she is talking about.



Siobhanne.

Voyager
12-31-2004, 01:20 PM
Siobhanne,

I have known you now for many years through this forum, and am aware of your situation. I have often wondered why you have stayed at this spiritually-abusive church for so long. I know that it would hurt you to leave, but it's obviously hurting you to stay.

Does your husband not see the abuse? Why does he want to stay in the church? I have learned that whenever someone is aware of spiritual abuse, the leadership will try to turn family members who are loyal to the church against the members who are concerned about the abuse.

Are you worried that if you leave the church you will lose your husband? I can relate with that. I left my church without knowing if my wife would leave with me. The leadership tried in vain to turn her against me, but she ended up leaving with me. A few months later she became as aware of the abuse as I was (I was involved with the ministry much more than she was, so I saw the abuse that took place behind closed doors).

I hope that you find a solution to resolve your dilemma.

:cool:

Siobhanne
12-31-2004, 02:08 PM
Leaving the church would mean not only leaving my husband but also my children. My in-laws have promised me they would do their best to interfere... a very cruel threat. I do not have a support system and he does.. something he ( and they) always remind me of. In many ways.. it is a control issue. My husband and his family are heavily involved in that church and have been for the best part of 30yrs. I've noticed that when my husband's critical thinking skills kick in ( and it does every now and then), there is always someone there to put a stop to it.. usually family. He runs everything by them ( or church leadership) for approval. Husband's reasons for staying are many.. family pressure (from family that is very overinvolved anyway) is part of it. They are involved in EVERY aspect of our life and would make things very difficult. The church encouages this. He has had no experience with any other church, so he has no basis for comparison. My husband tends to be introverted and a loner. Most of his connections in our church are through his family. To him ( and them) leaving the church (even for another) is tantamount to leaving God. To them, anyone who is not a member of and involved in THAT church is questionable at best.. and an infidel at the worst.

Siobhanne
I no longer participate in ANY ministries in this church. I am simply a body there.. and nothing more.

Doug64
12-31-2004, 04:25 PM
Hi Siobhanne:

I'm sorry you are going through such difficulties.

Having no other church experience can be a problem, especially when family members are involved with an abusive group.

Too bad your husband's critical thinking doesn't kick in more often.

I will pray about your situation.
It all sounds very familiar.

Doug :)

Ontheroad
12-31-2004, 06:07 PM
Siobhane,

I'm so sorry you're in such a painful and frustrating situation. I was on the other side of your situation: I was the spouse who couldn't (or wouldn't) see the inaccuracies and abusive aspects of my former church. My husband stopped attending our church about 6 years before I did. He was very concerned and repeatedly said he wanted me to leave the church too. Because he stopped attending and because he questioned the church, he thus became my enemy, according to my pastor. My pastor painted this picture of him as undiscerning, spiritually inferior, rebellious, irresponsible, and spiritually dangerous to me and my children. My pastor repeatedly told me that my husband was a huge spiritual open door to me and my children, allowing demons to run free in our home and attack us. (This was something he taught all of the church - that those who had family members or friends who disagreed with him and what our church was doing were spiritual open doors to the rest of us.) He even went so far as to tell me several times that he felt like the time would come that I wuold probably have to make the choice to leave my husband, since he was interfering with the "call" that God had on my role in the church. I would have to choose between my husband and God (which really equated to the pastor). I told my pastor I really didn't believe God was telling me to leave my husband, but I believed what he said about my husband being a spiritual open door and had several friends praying for my husband and for my poor spiritually attacked home. This hurt my husband greatly. He knew I had e-mail, phone, and in-person conversations about him and his harmful spiritual behavior. I am now so grieved that I did this to my husband, and so angry that I believed my mentally unstable and controlling pastor.

My dear husband stayed with me, even knowing that he was labelled a pariah. Twice, he asked me to go with him to a different church on Sunday evenings only, when my church didn't hold services anyway, so it wouldn't interfere with my attending my church. Being the dutifully brainwashed pawn that I was, I reported this to my pastor, who emphatically told me I should not attend the other church, even though the servivces would not conflict with our church services, because to do so would water down my faith and split my loyalties to God. I listened to him the first time. Then several months later, my husband repeated his request, because he just wanted to worship with me in some way, and this time I agreed to attend with him on Sunday evenings. When I told my pastor I had begun doing this, he was irate, livid. He said "I TOLD you not to do that." He said I was rebellious and disloyal and breaking covenant by doing that. Shortly after this is when I began to really see the light. It took some other much more drastic circumstances to make me leave, but eventually it happened.

I am so sorry for what you are going through. Having been on the other side, I know what it is like to be brow-beaten and essentially brainwashed to choose my pastor and church over my "rebellious" and "undiscerning' husband, to fear my pastor's disapproval and wrath if I left the church and believed my husband's concerns. I even was told that if I left, I would come up before the judgment thronw of God. But I did leave, and now I know my pastor will be the one coming up before the judgment throne of God for how he has destroyed so many lives.

I will pray that your husband will come to his senses and gain the righteous boldness to leave that church. I know for him, it is doubly hard because his family is in the church. I didn't have that aspect, and I can only imagine how that would add to his confusion and to the pull on him to stay at the church. Still, my husband had given up hope that I would ever leave that church, and yet I did. God kept working on me til I did. I will pray the same for you. Know you are cared about.

ex-shep
12-31-2004, 10:50 PM
I too am sorry to hear of the abuse. You may need to leave your husband behind for the sake of your dignity. You deserve to be treated with dignity and respect. You might want to contact AFF or Wellspring and speak to their staff for counsel and wisdom on how to proceed.

For me and my girlfriend at the time, we had to move out of state. Neither our families were supportive. My father, even though he was a fire breathing atheist had the nerve to say I would not survive withouth them. The group was in an exspansive growth mode and for me, it was too hot in the kitchen.

With the others, I will pray that you can direction on where to go from here.

Reg
01-02-2005, 12:56 PM
I too am sorry to hear of the abuse. You may need to leave your husband behind for the sake of your dignity. You deserve to be treated with dignity and respect. You might want to contact AFF or Wellspring and speak to their staff for counsel and wisdom on how to proceed.

With the others, I will pray that you can direction on where to go from here.
Siobhane,

Good advice. This is a very difficult and delicate position to be in. With me, it was like Ontheroad. I was on the other side of your situation. I defended the ministers and thought my wife was in the wrong. Here's the webpage I wrote about that several years ago, so I can sympathize with you.

An Example of Spiritual Abuse
http://www.marktab.org/borrow2.html

Until you actually leave it's very difficult to see it. Although you see it, your husband doesn't. I will pray God opens his eyes to see it. If he really loves you more than the church, it may open his eyes. Unlike my case, it doesn't have to end in divorce. I wish I had this board to discuss things with back then, but a lot of this is being talked about more recently. Back in the late 80's it was like a dead zone no one talked about.

It wasn't until a number of years after my divorce that I saw it completely and was able to write about it. I read this to my ex-wife a few years ago and she agreed completely.

Willow
01-03-2005, 10:34 AM
Siobhanne, I tears on my heart that you are in such a tortured position. I'm thinking of a quote in a Janis Joplin song "Freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose". You have so much to lose in this situation and it has totally stolen your freedom.

Like exshep, I got some good help from Wellspring Retreat Center http://www.wellspringretreat.org

Hey... maybe this is enough to start kicking in your husbands critical thinking in a deeper way. I'm hoping and praying he'll see the abuse. I desperately pray for that day to come for your family.

Voyager
01-04-2005, 08:01 AM
Siobhanne,

Have you ever considered slipping your husband some literature on cults, or the top-ten signs of an abusive church? Maybe stick it in his newspaper like it was some kind of flier insert or something. If it doesn't come from you, he may be less skeptical about it.

After I left my former church, I sent out anonymous fliers on the top-ten signs of an abusive church to dozens of members. Most of them have since left the church.

Just thinking of you. Hope this helps.

:cool: