Unlearning

[Elisabeth]

I realized something. I'm not trying to get over something that was done to me long ago as much as I'm trying to unlearn something that was taught to me. That's harder.

I didn't go to church very much until I was 18, at which point my boyfriend, who I had a child with when I was 19, started taking me. The problem is, that boyfriend misused scripture and church teaching to convince me that I was a slut :eek: , and all the people in the church would think I was, too. :mad: :( So even though people in the church was being nice to me, I distrusted them. I finally broke with that boyfriend, and decided to leave the church where I was going to; make a clean start. I ended up right away into the church where the pastor abused me. :eek: :mad: So it ended up I was a Christian, or at least involved in church, for seven years before I really got any inkling that I wasn't a slut, God didn't look at me that way, and the people in the church didn't look at me that way, too. :( :(

That's a long time. And even though that was a long time ago, it takes a long time to completely unlearn something that had been ingrained into me so deeply. I know I'm not a slut, never was, but it has been harder for me to realize that none of the people in the church look at me that way (or would look at me that way if they knew my past) too, or if some do, it's their problem, not mine! :)

[ex-shep]

It a challenge. I was angry at Tammy for years for introducing me to shepherding and fall the suffering I had to endure. In all fairness I had to work through the anger as part of the recovery process.

The tragic thing about spiritual abuse is that it can sour one's walk with the Lord for years. I could not stand anything evangelical. I could not stand hearing traditional Christmas Carols because I felt as if I were being preached at. No way was I going to go through that again.

Of course it was never Tammy's fault. Neither of us knew of mind control or spiritual abuse. We were doing the best we could with what we knew.

What helped was time. I had to get several years distance before I could trust the Bible and healthy fellowship. It probably would have helped if I had counseling. That may have hastened the recovery process a bit.

I do remember some rules when triggered.

1. I deserve to be in healthy relationships, including Christian fellowship.

2. I deserve to be treated with dignity and respect.

3. The toxic beliefs of my former group are no longer relevent. They do not serve a meaninful purpose. That was then. This is now.

4. I am no longer my group involvement.

Lest that I become dependent on churches and relationships, I temper any temptation toward grandiosity with "I thank God for the little corner of the Kingdom known as 'First Church' " I treat my wife and closest friends with the same line of reasoning. I helped me from coming addicted to my wife or anyone for that matter.

Have to clock in. Hope this helps.

[Elisabeth]

I realized also that I have a very hard time trusting pastors. :( I have a hard time not thinking they think I'm a slut; but not only that, I have a hard time trusting them to teach me right. :( I mean, it wasn't a love need or sex need that pastor took advantage of; it was a God need! :mad: I still have that need, and I still have the need for a pastor, and others, to teach me. :) And in order for a person to be teachable, they have to be able to trust the teacher, and that trust makes a person vulnerable. That vulnerability scares me. :eek: I mean, I know I can't be fooled in the same way, but there's many ways a person can be fooled. My mother in law has been fooled for twenty four years by her pastor. :eek: But I know that my problems with trust have kept me from growing spiritually.

[ex-shep]

I realized also that I have a very hard time trusting pastors. :( I have a hard time not thinking they think I'm a slut; but not only that, I have a hard time trusting them to teach me right. :( I mean, it wasn't a love need or sex need that pastor took advantage of; it was a God need! :mad: I still have that need, and I still have the need for a pastor, and others, to teach me. :) And in order for a person to be teachable, they have to be able to trust the teacher, and that trust makes a person vulnerable. That vulnerability scares me. :eek: I mean, I know I can't be fooled in the same way, but there's many ways a person can be fooled. My mother in law has been fooled for twenty four years by her pastor. :eek: But I know that my problems with trust have kept me from growing spiritually.

One thing that might work is finding christian women who you can trust. A professional counselor. One thing that helped me is being upfront with the pastor with the abuse. My experience from past posts on the topic, if a former member is upfront about the abuse, a good pastor will take that into consideration and work the member or visitor. Historically, after my group experiences, the pastors of the churches were generally supportive and non coercive. Obviously if one is or you are not feeling your needs are being fully met, it is OK to worship somewhere else.

I am acutely aware of the one burned twice shy.

[Elisabeth]

One thing that might work is finding christian women who you can trust. A professional counselor. One thing that helped me is being upfront with the pastor with the abuse. My experience from past posts on the topic, if a former member is upfront about the abuse, a good pastor will take that into consideration and work the member or visitor. Historically, after my group experiences, the pastors of the churches were generally supportive and non coercive. Obviously if one is or you are not feeling your needs are being fully met, it is OK to worship somewhere else.

I am acutely aware of the one burned twice shy.

Eh, I feel like I have been "counseled out" right now. I think my pastor is cool; I just am - once burned and twice shy. It didn't help that a couple of my pastors since then were boneheads, either. :p I think that I do need to realize, and am beginning to realize, that although I have been through a lot of s---, I still do deserve to be able to feel safe at church, and trust the pastor. :) 'Course, I'm not going to blindly trust just because he is a pastor; that's part of what made me so vulnerable to abuse before. :)

[DiligentLily]

I do remember some rules when triggered.

1. I deserve to be in healthy relationships, including Christian fellowship.

2. I deserve to be treated with dignity and respect.

3. The toxic beliefs of my former group are no longer relevent. They do not serve a meaninful purpose. That was then. This is now.

4. I am no longer my group involvement.
.

Number 2 is very interesting. I think I have always missed that fact in my whole life, which is I suppose why I felt comfortable in the unhealthy church in the first place. I didn't feel I needed to be treated with dignity and respect, and since they didn't, I was comfortable (sort of.)

[mary]

I realized also that I have a very hard time trusting pastors. :( I have a hard time not thinking they think I'm a slut; but not only that, I have a hard time trusting them to teach me right. :( I mean, it wasn't a love need or sex need that pastor took advantage of; it was a God need! :mad: I still have that need, and I still have the need for a pastor, and others, to teach me. :) And in order for a person to be teachable, they have to be able to trust the teacher, and that trust makes a person vulnerable. That vulnerability scares me. :eek: I mean, I know I can't be fooled in the same way, but there's many ways a person can be fooled. My mother in law has been fooled for twenty four years by her pastor. :eek: But I know that my problems with trust have kept me from growing spiritually.

Of course, Elisabeth, you have a hard time trusting pastors... Any sane person in your circumstances would. And as you're one of the Lord's own dear ones, one of His lambs, of course you need a shepherd.

The problem is that there are so few true and good shepherds out there these days. The woods are teeming with false ones. My husband and I were just out at lunch today with a man who's been a Bible study teacher for well over 20 years and he says that now he "just doesn't know" of any "really good" or trustworthy pastors - including the one he's now sitting under.

It would take a very special pastor to make most of us here trust a clergyman again. Even though I'm trying to get a certain church started here again, I doubt that I'll ever really trust one again. But to whose account is your lack of trust, mine and everyone else's laid? Not, most definitely, to ours! To theirs! These people will pay for what they've done to us. This is all part of God's plan; He will bring His vengeance upon these evil-doers. In doing so, though, He will gift us with His love, mercy, tenderness, forgiveness and most remarkably, His presence and His counsel. And He will gather us again under good shepherds. All we have is His promise that He'll do so (Ezekiel 34; Jeremiah 23). And that's enough. :)

You will grow spiritually, Elisabeth, with or without a pastor. The Lord will see to it. I've grown more spiritually in the year and a half that it's been since I was thrown out of that "church" than I had in probably the ten years before that happened. At least I'm away from one of Satan's lackeys, which is what "pastor" was and probably still is - and you are, too. You just stay in His Word and He'll give you the increase...

mary

[Elisabeth]

I have realized how much the abuse Tami and Luke had gone through at that church triggered me! Total trigger! :( I am reliving it; not pleasant. :( But you know what? I also feel God more than I ever have before, also. It's because I am triggered, but know that nothing of there was from God. :) I think I need to go to sleep; maybe I'll feel better in the morning. :p

[Elisabeth]

I have been trusting my current pastor more and more. I just realized that I was ready to come out of my "shell" at the same time that I have a pastor who treats me like a worthwhile human being. :D That goes a long way. :D He is not perfect, he doesn't always know what to say, but that's okay. He's real; he loves the Lord and is a leader, not a controller. :D

[ex-shep]

Eh, I feel like I have been "counseled out" right now. I think my pastor is cool; I just am - once burned and twice shy. It didn't help that a couple of my pastors since then were boneheads, either. :p I think that I do need to realize, and am beginning to realize, that although I have been through a lot of s---, I still do deserve to be able to feel safe at church, and trust the pastor. :) 'Course, I'm not going to blindly trust just because he is a pastor; that's part of what made me so vulnerable to abuse before. :)



That why there is always the disclaimor "take what you like and leave the rest". If the pastor and the church feels safe, go for that for now. Sounds like a winner.