Feeling ashamed

[Ontheroad]

It's been seven months since I left my abusive church of 12 years. I have good and bad days. Some days, I don't think about it very much, but other days, I do and am flooded with sadness and/or anger. Sometimes, like yesterday and today, I am also filled with so much shame. I can't believe I stayed in such a horrible place for so long. It is SO obvious now when I look back on it that I should have left years ago.

In addition to the dynamics of the pastor being abusive as my pastor, he was also my counselor for several years. He should NEVER have been counseling people. During the counseling, I came to believe "memories" that I now know were false. I have a friend in the same boat, who was also counseled by him and now realizes her "memories" were false. So I know it wasn't limited just to me. But still, I am so angry with myself and ashamed that I believe the lies and errant practices of this man, both as my pastor and my counselor. I am flooded with anger at him for being abusive and incompetent and selfishly uncaring, but I am also flooded with anger, shame, and contempt for myself, that I would be so gullible.

Part of it is that my husband, kids, and I spent Thanksgiving yesterday with my parents and brother, and the subject of the false memories and the abusive church stuff came up. They are supportive of me and did not come down on me yesterday. But I can still see in their eyes and behind their words the pain I unintentionally caused by the false memories I believed and by staying in that stupid church like I did. I hate it that I hurt my family.

Feeling really, really, REALLY low today :( And mad and sad and so ashamed.

[Ontheroad]

.....and now I'm feeling embarrassed for posting this here. I hope everyone here doesn't now think I'm a freak for the false memory stuff. :(

[Voyager]

.....and now I'm feeling embarrassed for posting this here. I hope everyone here doesn't now think I'm a freak for the false memory stuff. :(

NO WAY Ontheroad!!! You are not a freak. What you are describing is a classic tactic of spiritual abusers. They try to use our past to control our future. They brainwash people into believing whatever they can to support their power-hold on your life.

I am glad that you have re-connected with those who were also victims of your spiritual abuser. By implicating your family members into his false memory-scam, he was abusing them also. I wish there were laws against people like him. The world would be much safer.

:cool:

[Reg]

It's been seven months since I left my abusive church of 12 years. I have good and bad days. Some days, I don't think about it very much, but other days, I do and am flooded with sadness and/or anger. Sometimes, like yesterday and today, I am also filled with so much shame. I can't believe I stayed in such a horrible place for so long. It is SO obvious now when I look back on it that I should have left years ago.

That's how a lot of us feel. :(

In addition to the dynamics of the pastor being abusive as my pastor, he was also my counselor for several years. He should NEVER have been counseling people. During the counseling, I came to believe "memories" that I now know were false. I have a friend in the same boat, who was also counseled by him and now realizes her "memories" were false. So I know it wasn't limited just to me. But still, I am so angry with myself and ashamed that I believe the lies and errant practices of this man, both as my pastor and my counselor. I am flooded with anger at him for being abusive and incompetent and selfishly uncaring, but I am also flooded with anger, shame, and contempt for myself, that I would be so gullible.

Sure sounds a lot like many of us. Anger is a good sign. It means you've moved past denial and are on your way to healing. Remember, emotions by themselves are not wrong. We've been conditioned to stuff, only to our own hurt. One caution on the anger however. It is only one letter away from D - anger. :o

Part of it is that my husband, kids, and I spent Thanksgiving yesterday with my parents and brother, and the subject of the false memories and the abusive church stuff came up. They are supportive of me and did not come down on me yesterday. But I can still see in their eyes and behind their words the pain I unintentionally caused by the false memories I believed and by staying in that stupid church like I did. I hate it that I hurt my family.

Feeling really, really, REALLY low today :( And mad and sad and so ashamed.


It's a humbling and maddening thing all at the same time to come to the realization of how we treated them. Humble towards them and angry at our abusers.

Please be careful. Shame does not come from God.

[Voyager]

Part of it is that my husband, kids, and I spent Thanksgiving yesterday with my parents and brother, and the subject of the false memories and the abusive church stuff came up. They are supportive of me and did not come down on me yesterday. But I can still see in their eyes and behind their words the pain I unintentionally caused by the false memories I believed and by staying in that stupid church like I did. I hate it that I hurt my family.

I have learned the hard way that not everyone is interested in what we went through in our abusive churches. More often than not, it can be a turn-off to people who were not involved. They cannot understand it, and you may even alienate them by trying to share it with them. For the most part, only people who have experienced spiritual abuse can relate with what you went through.

There really isn't much that you could share with us that would shock us. Don't worry about telling too much here. The people here can relate with your experience.

:cool:

[Reg]

.....and now I'm feeling embarrassed for posting this here. I hope everyone here doesn't now think I'm a freak for the false memory stuff. :(

Ontheroad,

Please don't feel embarrassed. We understand. You have found a place of safety here where many of us could share similar stories. You have been taken advantage of and were deceived. The ones who are the real freaks are those Controlling Freaks :mad: who manipulated you to satisfy their own disfunction. Many are sociopaths. You were just a victim, not a freak.

You are among friends that do understand. Many of us share similar emotions about what happened to us.

Please feel free to let it all here. We will listen and understand. Don't stuff any longer. You have a lot of baggage to get rid of. This is the place to do that. Let us help to make your road to recovery lighter. :p

[Ontheroad]

Voyager and Reg,

Thank you both very much for your responses. It is comforting to be able to share some of what happened and have others understand and be accepting of me. I think I lived under constant projected guilt from my pastor and from someone whom I thoughth was my friend in my former church. It was a very legalistic, condemning environment for the church as a whole from the sermons, and also personally in the "counseling" sessions. I was always told to spend time on working on "me" was selfish and self-centered and I was told that the emotions like depression, sadness, etc. were signs that I needed to get right with God. I think there is alot to overcome with all of that, because I constantly felt guilty of something, even when I didn't know what I had done. I still feel that way alot.

Thank you again for your responses and for your care. It means alot because I know everyone here has alot on their plate, yet they all reach out anyway. This is an awesome forum.

[Reg]

Voyager and Reg,

Thank you both very much for your responses. It is comforting to be able to share some of what happened and have others understand and be accepting of me. I think I lived under constant projected guilt from my pastor and from someone whom I thoughth was my friend in my former church. It was a very legalistic, condemning environment for the church as a whole from the sermons, and also personally in the "counseling" sessions. I was always told to spend time on working on "me" was selfish and self-centered and I was told that the emotions like depression, sadness, etc. were signs that I needed to get right with God. I think there is a lot to overcome with all of that, because I constantly felt guilty of something, even when I didn't know what I had done. I still feel that way a lot.
Ontheroad,

Here's an article on Shame and Guilt posted By: Voyager Date: Friday, 3 January 2003

This is most likely what you're going through right now. These feelings do not come from God. There is no condemnation from Him towards us.

Rom 8:1 ¶ [There is] therefore now no condemnation to those [who are] in Christ Jesus, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. (MKJV)

Joh 5:24 Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes on Him who sent Me has everlasting life and shall not come into condemnation, but has passed from death to life. (MKJV)

Feelings of shame & guilt is what the enemy wants us to feel. We can feel convicted of sin and want to repent but not guilt. We are all sinners and we all need to be forgiven. Guilt has nothing to do with it. Conviction YES!. Guilt - NO!

Hope this helps. :)

-----------------------------------

All abusive cults use three common tools on their followers: fear, shame, and guilt. Here's an article that I found on the effects of shame and guilt:

Prompting Events for Feeling Shame and Guilt:

Doing (feeling or thinking) something you (or people you admire) believe is wrong or immoral. Being reminded of something wrong immoral, or shameful you did in the past. Exposure of a very private aspect of yourself or your life. Having others find out that you have done something wrong. Being laughed at or made fun of. Being criticized in public, in front of someone else. Others attacking your integrity and not feeling respected. Being betrayed by a person you love or care about. Being rejected by people you love or care about. Failing at something you feel you are (or should be) competent to do. Being rejected or criticized for something you expected praise or acknowledgment of. Having emotions that have been invalidated. Interpretations that Prompt Feelings of Shame and Guilt:

Believing your body (or body part) is too big, too small, or not the right size. Thinking that you are bad, immoral, or wrong.Thinking that you have not lived up to your expectations of yourself. Thinking that you have not lived up to the expectations of others. Thinking that your behavior, thoughts, or feelings are silly, stupid, or dumb. Judging yourself to be inferior, not good enough, not as good as others. Comparing yourself to others and thinking that you are a loser. Believing yourself unlovable and undeserving. Experiencing the Emotion of Shame and Guilt:

Pain in the pit of the stomach. Sense of dread and doom. Crying, tears, sobbing. Blushing, hot, red face. Wanting to hide or cover your face. Jitteriness or nervousness. Choking sensation, suffocating. Expressing and Acting on Shame and Guilt:

Withdrawing, covering the face, hiding, or running away. Bowing your head, kneeling before the person, or groveling. Eyes down, darting eyes (looking away as if to ignore). Avoiding the person you have harmed or the people you know you have done wrong or think you have done wrong. Sinking back in a slumped position. Saying you are sorry; apologizing. Asking for forgiveness. Giving gifts, trying to make up for the transgression. Trying to repair the harm, fix up the damage, or change the course. After Effects of Shame and Guilt:

Avoiding thinking about your transgression, shutting down, blocking all emotions, or distancing yourself. Engaging in distracting, impulsive behaviors to divert your mind or attention. Believing you are defective and unworthy. Making resolutions to change. Depersonalization, dissociative experiences, numbness, or shock. Intense anger, sadness, fear, or other negative emotions. Isolation, feeling alientated, or abandoned. Critical negative self talk that you are no good and underserving. Guilt can be a very appropriate response to having done something we know is wrong. It is what we do with guilt that makes it a problem, not the guilt itself. When we do something that we know (or come to know) does not fit into our belief system or something that we know is harmful to ourselves or others, or we know we should not have done, guilt is an appropriate response. These feelings of guilt can serve the very good purpose of being an activator to owning our behavior [taking responsibility], making our amends, and moving on with our lives, all the wiser for our learning (Schaef, 2000).

When Shame or Guilt (Conviction) is Justified:

Repair the transgression; apologize; make things better commit to avoiding the mistake in the future accept the consequences gracefully then let it go. Due to our past experiences ... shame and guilt may be imbedded into our minds and it is difficult to just let go. Every time someone says something or does something we begin to take it personally ... only added to the shame and guilt that we already feel. We wind up "fueling" an already vulnerable self with more negative emotional weight.

When Shame or Guilt is Unjustified:

Do what makes you feel shameful or guilty over and over and over approach - do not avoid learn competency and mastery. Be mindful that feelings of shame or guilt can come from distorted thinking, such as all-or-nothing, over generalization, mental filter, discounting the positives, jumping to conclusions, magnification or minimization, emotional reasoning, "should" statements, labeling, and blame. Ask yourself "What emotion am I feeling? and "Why?" If it is justified -- do what you need to do to take care of it ... if it is unjustified connect to that emotion and do the opposite to reduce the intensity or diminish the shame or guilt.

(Sources: Meditations for Living in Balance: Daily Solutions for People Who Do Too Much. New York, NY: Harper SanFrancisco)

[OldEnt]

.....and now I'm feeling embarrassed for posting this here. I hope everyone here doesn't now think I'm a freak for the false memory stuff. :(

OnTheRoad,

My wife's niece is caught up in a Charismatic cult which used the False Memory Syndrome to aleinate her from her family. The FM stuff is used to control, and how it's used in these cases fits classic cultic brainwashing practices.

Don't feel embarrassed. If you came out, then there is hope that our niece can come out. Her situation is complicated in that she is now married to one of the cult leaders...

I'm thankful you were brave enough to share that part of your abuse. More people need to be aware of the kind of abusive trap FM is being used for...

In His healing love,

Old Ent

[Doug64]

On The Road:


No need to feel embarrassed for staying so long.
It took my wife and me about 40 years to wake up to the fact we were in an abusive group.
Thankfully, they have made positive changes in the last 10 years. We left in 1999 because we felt the changes hadn't gone far enough.

Doug :cool:

[Jerry]

I can't be sure because your post is a little vague in spacific areas,,,,but this "Pastor" you speek about may be commiting crimes.I suggest that you talk it over with a Prosecuting Attorney.
Love Jerry