Getting Along With Each Other

[secrethopes]

Awhile ago I ran across this amazing Biblical guide to effective relationship that was written by Richard L. Strauss. It is really practical and has really changed how I view relationship. I've learned so much from this guide and wanted to share it with all of you. I downloaded the Word document and printed it out so I wouldn't have to be online or at the computer to read it. It is 53 pages long, I think, but well worth the time I spent on it. You can get a copy at bible.org (http://www.bible.org/series.php?series_id=56) if you are interested.

An Excerpt:

Wouldn’t it be great if we Christians could always get along with each other? It seems as though we should. We have so much in common—one Lord, one revealed Word from Him, one Body of which we are all members, one common desire to glorify Jesus Christ, one common goal to share Him with others. And yet we seem to have a reputation for misunderstandings, disagreements, dissension and division.

We’ve all witnessed little cliques, gossip and hard feelings between Christians. We’re all aware of church splits, the formation of new denominations and the proliferation of para-church organizations, often overlapping in their aims and purposes. We’ve all observed crumbling marriages among professing Christians. We must admit that Christians do not always get along very well with each other. How can it be?

I would like to explore that question by examining an intense disagreement between two great and godly men in Scripture, close friends and fellow workers. It was a disagreement that resulted in the parting of their paths and the fracturing of their friendship. It is not a pretty story. In fact, it is rather sad. It never should have happened. But I for one, am glad it did, and I am pleased that the Holy Spirit was honest enough to tell us about it. It helps us to know that the great heroes of the faith were human, just like us. When we see what God did through them in spite of their weaknesses, we know there is hope for us. And by examining their mistakes, we also learn how to maintain harmonious relations with those around us.

[Anna Marta]

Dear Secrethopes,

Thank you! I loved it! Am looking forward to going through the study and sharing it with my husband.

Love
Anna Marta

[secrethopes]

Dear Secrethopes,

Thank you! I loved it! Am looking forward to going through the study and sharing it with my husband.

Love
Anna Marta

I'm glad. :)

One of my more favorite sections was "You Make Me So Mad." At first I thought, "Been there. Done that." Then I realized that the anger had done nothing to remedy the situation. In fact, over the years, I had become discouraged and decided it was pointless to even try to maintain a clean house. So, for a time, I was not ready to entertain strangers as we are instructed to do in Hebrews 13. ;)

I also related to the "Mending Nets" section. I grew up in a black and white environment where being right and proving you are right is the highest priority. I'd heard we needed to pick our battles but didn't really understand what it meant. I really like what he had to say: The “I win, you lose,” or “I’m right, you’re wrong” approach will make the other person want either to fight or to withdraw; either way, both lose. I had never really thought about it in this way. Sometimes "being right" is not worth sacrificing the relationship. God knows the truth and prayer can change people and situations much easier than we can. In fact, I think we often alienate those we wish to be closest to.

Anyhow, I hope you enjoy the study. The entire guide is definitely an inspiration.

[Voyager]

Wouldn’t it be great if we Christians could always get along with each other? It seems as though we should. We have so much in common—one Lord, one revealed Word from Him, one Body of which we are all members, one common desire to glorify Jesus Christ, one common goal to share Him with others. And yet we seem to have a reputation for misunderstandings, disagreements, dissension and division.
I think this is due to the extremist nature that religion takes on. Many people call this "black and white thinking". Although we may all believe in Jesus, many of us have different ideas about what He requires of us. If one person thinks Jesus wants them to pay tithes to their local church, then that person may impose this belief on everyone around them. Or, if somebody thinks Jesus wants them to stay poor and never succeed financially, them may impose this on everyone around them. This is the type of thinking that causes divisions and dissensions.

My philosophy is to live and let live. I may tell someone about my beliefs, but I do my best to never impose them on anyone. If someone disagrees with my beliefs, I am perfectly okay with that. However, if someone shames my beliefs and tells me that they are inferior to their beliefs in a condemning and condescending way - I don't take too kindly to that... but I'm working on it.

:cool:

[Anna Marta]

My word, what a wise and loving person you are! What a wonderful thing that you are a part of the forum.

I will look forward to sharing some of my "takes" as I go through the study. Thanks for your insights. It is very encouraging and inspiring for me when people are able to share some of their close encounters with the scriptures and how they speak so directly into our lives. Getting away from twisting the word of God and back into the refreshing examination is like a glass of cold water on a hot day!

Hope this day is filled with giggles and smiles
Anna Marta

[Patty]

Do any of us believe in the "Great Commission" which essentially does tell us to go and share our belief in the gospel?
Would this be the same thing as putting our beliefs on someone else? Or is the whole point of being a follower of Jesus?

[Voyager]

The “I win, you lose,” or “I’m right, you’re wrong” approach will make the other person want either to fight or to withdraw; either way, both lose.
That is so true. I don't think I have ever witnessed a hostile religious debate where someone didn't feel the need to prove that they were right in order to validate their own belief system. In the end, everyone loses because the need to win the argument was paramount to the debate. When we force someone to believe the way we do, we take away their right to choose and think for themselves.

:cool:

[mary]

Do any of us believe in the "Great Commission" which essentially does tell us to go and share our belief in the gospel?
Would this be the same thing as putting our beliefs on someone else? Or is the whole point of being a follower of Jesus?

Well, sure, Patty, one of the reasons that we're saved is to employ the Great Commission for God's purposes and in His ways. "Self" is supposed to become so much less prominent (John 3:30) and He is supposed to dominate and take over in our faith (Galatians 2:20). Our beliefs are not "our" beliefs as much as they are His - and He's the one Who's important. The more the Holy Spirit indwells us, the less of our egos will be evident. I thank Him for that, because right now, just as an aside, I'm pretty sick of myself...:cool: :D !

(Voyager...)
That is so true. I don't think I have ever witnessed a hostile religious debate where someone didn't feel the need to prove that they were right in order to validate their own belief system. In the end, everyone loses because the need to win the argument was paramount to the debate. When we force someone to believe the way we do, we take away their right to choose and think for themselves.

I'm so glad you've decided to stay with us, Voyager! :)

You and I haven't met, so my attitude may be a bit out of the ordinary when you hear it, but when I've gotten into a discussion with someone on a religious issue, especially pastors, my goal isn't to prove I'm right. I just like to talk about Scripture. It doesn't matter at all to me what that person thinks of me or what I've said (maybe I've said it badly!); it does matter what they think of Jesus Christ, but if that person is totally rejecting of Scripture, then they and I are not likely to have a lot in common and I'm better off just leaving off politely and artfully changing the subject to something that that person is interested in. I don't think that's abandoning the Great Commission; it's just waiting for God's timing... I do that a lot. It's a "win-win" for both of us involved in the exchange: I get to keep the relationship, possibly for "another go;" they don't think badly of people like me or of the Gospel, and no one is shamed. I've been listening to a lot of people lately - just listening, not arguing; I've been listening to lapsed Catholics, gay, mainline Protestants, rabbinic Jews, atheists, agnostics, other self-professed Christians and others. Not debating, just listening and piping up gently with the Gospel when I get an opportunity. I know what I believe, but it doesn't bother me at all if someone disagrees with me or - in the case of my birth family - hates me for what I believe. That's just life... And God will take care of the results of what I do or don't do.

(A technical point for anyone: how do you "multi-quote" the same and/or different posts? I've tried and tried - and failed repeatedly. Obviously, I'm no geek with this system... :o Thanks in advance for any tips.)

Grace and shalom to all,

mary

[Voyager]

...how do you "multi-quote" the same and/or different posts?
After you click the Quote button, copy and paste the original quote into your reply box as many times as needed and then remove the verbiage you don't want to use from each instance. As far as quoting different posts, you would have to scroll down to the post and copy the text you want to quote (or right-click over the Quote button, select "Open in new window", and then copy the quote) and then paste it into the reply box.

:cool:

[Voyager]

You and I haven't met, so my attitude may be a bit out of the ordinary when you hear it, but when I've gotten into a discussion with someone on a religious issue, especially pastors, my goal isn't to prove I'm right. I just like to talk about Scripture. It doesn't matter at all to me what that person thinks of me or what I've said (maybe I've said it badly!); it does matter what they think of Jesus Christ, but if that person is totally rejecting of Scripture, then they and I are not likely to have a lot in common and I'm better off just leaving off politely and artfully changing the subject to something that that person is interested in. I don't think that's abandoning the Great Commission; it's just waiting for God's timing...
Agreed. What I was referring to is a "hostile" religious debate where both sides feel the need to prove their point in order to win the argument. That always ends up with both sides losing.

:cool:

[Satscout]

It doesn't matter at all to me what that person thinks of me or what I've said (maybe I've said it badly!); it does matter what they think of Jesus Christ, but if that person is totally rejecting of Scripture, then they and I are not likely to have a lot in common and I'm better off just leaving off politely and artfully changing the subject to something that that person is interested in. I don't think that's abandoning the Great Commission; it's just waiting for God's timing... I do that a lot. It's a "win-win" for both of us involved in the exchange: I get to keep the relationship, possibly for "another go;" they don't think badly of people like me or of the Gospel, and no one is shamed. I've been listening to a lot of people lately - just listening, not arguing; I've been listening to lapsed Catholics, gay, mainline Protestants, rabbinic Jews, atheists, agnostics, other self-professed Christians and others. Not debating, just listening and piping up gently with the Gospel when I get an opportunity. I know what I believe, but it doesn't bother me at all if someone disagrees with me or - in the case of my birth family - hates me for what I believe. That's just life... And God will take care of the results of what I do or don't do.

This is an extremely important point and one I hope doesn't get lost in the other wonderful points in this discussion: You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar, it is said.

I know some people - and I am certain most of the forum readers can identify folks like this in their own experience - who firmly believe the Great Commission is an excuse to browbeat everyone they meet into believing exactly what they do in order that they may be "not guilty" of the blood of all men. This is based on a Pauline quote, the location of which escapes me at the moment, where he says he has expressed the Gospel at all times to all men so that when the judgment came, he would not be held responsible. (Everybody have their specific examples in mind yet? :rolleyes: )

God doesn't call us to "save" people. And He doesn't even call us to slam everybody in our path with the "gospel". He calls us to live and love, and work out our own relationship with Him... and then find out what place each of us would have in what He is doing. Back to Paul again - some for the planting, some for the watering, some for the harvest... and we do not and cannot always know where we are in that chain of events, or if something we do or say in the present could have an impact on someone in the future. Therefore, we can and should only be held responsible for our own actions and choices, including making amends when we screw up.

Excellent post. Kudos, Mary!

[Carmen]

I think this is due to the extremist nature that religion takes on. Many people call this "black and white thinking". Although we may all believe in Jesus, many of us have different ideas about what He requires of us. If one person thinks Jesus wants them to pay tithes to their local church, then that person may impose this belief on everyone around them. Or, if somebody thinks Jesus wants them to stay poor and never succeed financially, them may impose this on everyone around them. This is the type of thinking that causes divisions and dissensions.

My philosophy is to live and let live. I may tell someone about my beliefs, but I do my best to never impose them on anyone. If someone disagrees with my beliefs, I am perfectly okay with that. However, if someone shames my beliefs and tells me that they are inferior to their beliefs in a condemning and condescending way - I don't take too kindly to that... but I'm working on it.

:cool:

I agree. Through "training" on another forum I have learned much about living and letting live. There are some lively discussions about different life philosophies, some within Christianity too, but I learned a lot toward respecting others views as long as they had reasoned things through (a pet peeve of mine is someone defending a belief or view that they have not thoroughly researched and thought through - like someone in a cult), and not call such views inferior. Different is okay.

I'm kind of used to hard knocks concerning what I believe, I just don't like it when someone associates what I believe with my person, saying that I am sinful or inadequate because of what I believe, when they just disagree with my beliefs. I see that as an attack on myself, not just my beliefs. Every individual always has a great value in my opinion, no matter what he believes, and should be respected at least for the fact that he is human, created in God's image. Ironically enough, we often treat our animals, our pets, better than we treat one another.

[Jerry]

It is my opinion that much "rancor" could be avoided if the "Great Commission" were taught properly ......First,,,,The Great Commission isn't about "Water Baptism".........:eek: ,,,,,,,yes thats right.....Verses 19 and 20 of Matt 28 are delivered together without pause.Here's how it should be taught......

Verse 19 "Go therefore and make disciples of all nations,baptizing them in the name of Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit".....

Remember "Baptize" means to "totally immerse",,,,,,,,,the verse here continues discussing what to totally immerse them in.........

Verse 20 "teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you and lo , I am with you always,even to the end of the age".....

Here's the key,,,,,,,,,Christ in His whole ministry only delivered to us one ,yes count them ,,,,,,one,,,,,,, command,,,,,,,,,,,John 13/34 "A new "Commandment" I give to you,that you love one another;as I have loved you,that you also love one another."..............That is proper teaching.....God and Christ don't need us to defend them They are Big Boys they can take care of themselves,,,,,,,,,thank you very much LOL :D

Love Jerry

[secrethopes]

My word, what a wise and loving person you are! What a wonderful thing that you are a part of the forum.

I will look forward to sharing some of my "takes" as I go through the study. Thanks for your insights. It is very encouraging and inspiring for me when people are able to share some of their close encounters with the scriptures and how they speak so directly into our lives. Getting away from twisting the word of God and back into the refreshing examination is like a glass of cold water on a hot day!

Hope this day is filled with giggles and smiles
Anna Marta

Thank you, Anna Marta, for your compliments. It's nice to receive honest compliments and not have to stop to wonder what the person wants in return. :D I look forward to hearing your "takes." :)

[secrethopes]

That is so true. I don't think I have ever witnessed a hostile religious debate where someone didn't feel the need to prove that they were right in order to validate their own belief system. In the end, everyone loses because the need to win the argument was paramount to the debate. When we force someone to believe the way we do, we take away their right to choose and think for themselves.

:cool:

Yes. I agree. I've been in two opposing camps at one time or another. :(

The first insists you accept their views to be accepted and is hostile--hostile for Christ? There is rarely resolution here and it is almost always best to avoid these people.

The other insists that we should just ignore injustices and false teachings and pretend the boat is filled with daisies--no discussions or "negativism" of any kind. It's gives a sense of being "plastic" in the name of love.

I don't fit into either camp. But I've come to accept this. :)

[secrethopes]

I think this is due to the extremist nature that religion takes on. Many people call this "black and white thinking". Although we may all believe in Jesus, many of us have different ideas about what He requires of us.

Yes, it makes me sad. When did loving Jesus involve competition? It shouldn't be about denominations or movements. There are black and white guidelines in the Bible (i.e. the ten commandments), but much of the Bible expects us to sort out the gray. Yet we also are required to deal mercifully with those who don't claim the same freedoms. I think this should work in the other direction as well--show mercy to those who do claim freedoms if we are a person who sees only in black and white. ;)

[Anna Marta]

When I taught in a school of compassionate care here in Norway below was the a central point in one course.

Justice is black and white - but mercy is found in shades of gray. Always ask God for mercy never justice - because if God gives us what we deserve under a just system where would any of us be?

On simple question - Please will you forgive me? - has the power to wipe away all manner of bad feelings. It has melted my heart many many times the way the words "I'm sorry" simply cannot do.

One is a cry for the mercy the other is a statement of a fact we hope will be believed.

Love
Anna Marta

[exwitchoz]

Justice is black and white - but mercy is found in shades of gray. Always ask God for mercy never justice - because if God gives us what we deserve under a just system where would any of us be?

On simple question - Please will you forgive me? - has the power to wipe away all manner of bad feelings. It has melted my heart many many times the way the words "I'm sorry" simply cannot do.

One is a cry for the mercy the other is a statement of a fact we hope will be believed.

You just made a bronzed Ozzie male weep...

[yeshua'smags]

Excellent Anna!!! Exactly!!

[mary]

This is an extremely important point and one I hope doesn't get lost in the other wonderful points in this discussion: You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar, it is said.

I know some people - and I am certain most of the forum readers can identify folks like this in their own experience - who firmly believe the Great Commission is an excuse to browbeat everyone they meet into believing exactly what they do in order that they may be "not guilty" of the blood of all men. This is based on a Pauline quote, the location of which escapes me at the moment, where he says he has expressed the Gospel at all times to all men so that when the judgment came, he would not be held responsible. (Everybody have their specific examples in mind yet? :rolleyes: )

God doesn't call us to "save" people. And He doesn't even call us to slam everybody in our path with the "gospel". He calls us to live and love, and work out our own relationship with Him... and then find out what place each of us would have in what He is doing. Back to Paul again - some for the planting, some for the watering, some for the harvest... and we do not and cannot always know where we are in that chain of events, or if something we do or say in the present could have an impact on someone in the future. Therefore, we can and should only be held responsible for our own actions and choices, including making amends when we screw up.

Excellent post. Kudos, Mary!

Awww, shucks, Satscout... Thanks... :o :) The Lord has been using some pretty heavy-duty, earth-moving equipment on me in the last few months and some things are starting to take shape... All praise and glory to Him!

You're so right that God doesn't call us to "save" anyone, nor does He call us to smashmouth street-preaching or marathon broadsiding or anything that calls attention to us. We're called to do something much harder: live the Life. The Life that our precious Lord and Savior gave us when He saved us... And, of course, tell others about Him while pursuing that Life.

What could any of us possibly have that would be a better, primary purpose for living? :) :) :)

Happy Lord's Day!

Blessings and grace, mercy and love in Him,

mary