Picked up a new book by Phillip Yancey

[profnachos]

Soul Survivor - How Thirteen Unlikely Mentors Helped My Faith Survive the Church.

Survive the Church. LOL!

I am really looking forward to reading this. Has anyone else read it?

The first Phillip Yancey book I read was called "I was wondering (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0802846122/sr=1-1/qid=1147242556/ref=sr_1_1/002-5583799-0551211?%5Fencoding=UTF8)" It was a collection of essays many of which challenged the fundamentalist dogma that I deeply entrenched in. Was so mad that I ripped out his picture, but didn't do the same to the book since I paid good money for that book.

His words deeply offended me, but they planted seeds in me. He is the single most imporant "mentor" responsible for my departure from fundamentalism.

[Theodora]

Soul Survivor - How Thirteen Unlikely Mentors Helped My Faith Survive the Church.

Survive the Church. LOL!

I am really looking forward to reading this. Has anyone else read it?

The first Phillip Yancey book I read was called "I was wondering (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0802846122/sr=1-1/qid=1147242556/ref=sr_1_1/002-5583799-0551211?%5Fencoding=UTF8)" It was a collection of essays many of which challenged the fundamentalist dogma that I deeply entrenched in. Was so mad that I ripped out his picture, but didn't do the same to the book since I paid good money for that book.

His words deeply offended me, but they planted seeds in me. He is the single most imporant "mentor" responsible for my departure from fundamentalism.

Hi, ProfNachos...! No--- I've not read this, but have read good reviews about it. However, I've liked Yancey's book"Disappointment with God" and have mentioned this before....not sure where at the moment...perhaps on the No Crosstalk forum?

ANYWAY...let us know what you think after you read the book, please.

Thanks for your continuing interest in this forum and your information.

Grace and peace--

Theodora

[tke316]

As soon as I saw the recommendation for Soul Survivor about a week ago I requested it at two different libraries. I picked it up at the first library and tried to cancel my request at the second library. Murphey's Law (and when it rains, it pours.) I couldn't get the system to accept the cancel of my request, so now I have two copies. :confused: :o

I forwarded the book review to a friend who is fed up with organized religion. :rolleyes: And when I got ahold of the first copy I started reading. I'm into his description of how he went from being a southern good-old-boy to admiring Martin Luther King Jr. :)

[Illuminated]

Survive the Church. LOL!LOL!!!!:D Maybe this is an emerging trend in the Christian world today .... surviving the church! I haven't read the Yancy book, but I think I will.

I did pick up a copy of Full Gospel, Fractured Minds? (http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/product?item_no=6308X&p=1006327) A Call to Use God's Gift of the Intellect, by Rick Nanez. First Nanez discusses the relationship of the heart, mind, soul, spirit, and intellect and gives Scripture examples from both the Old and New Testament.

Then he writes a little history of the pentecostal/full gospel/charismatic movement regarding how the anti-intellectual perspective developed. Lastly he supports his case, through extensive Scripture references, of how using the intellect is ordained by God. I think he supports his contention very well because he uses examples from the Bible and verses from the Bible to illustrate his concepts.

I am surprised he had the guts to write it because I think he is still involved in the Full Gospel movement. The back cover reads "Glorify God with your mind as well as with your heart and spirit."

Speaking of surviving (in this case the Charismatic movement) - are you familiar with Robbie McAlpine and his writings on being Post-Charismatic? An article was published recently and you can view some of it at:
http://the-next-wave-ezine.info/issue87/index.cfm?id=10&ref=COVERSTORY

This is also an interesting site, where Robby talks about Detoxing from Church: http://www.robbymac.org/detox.html

[profnachos]

Theodora - I will post a review when I am done.

tke316 - Well, the Murphy's Law would be the two libraries canceling each other, and you not getting any copy at all. It's great that you got the books. Are these public libraries? Quite surprising that public libraries would carry these books.

Illuminated - Yes, the anti-intellctual bent comes across very loud and clear. Are we not supposed to be innocent as a dove, but also wise as a serpent? We need to be smart about these things. I have seen Robby's site and it is quite insightful. I like it a lot.

[newlife]

Speaking of surviving (in this case the Charismatic movement) - are you familiar with Robbie McAlpine and his writings on being Post-Charismatic? An article was published recently and you can view some of it at:
http://the-next-wave-ezine.info/issue87/index.cfm?id=10&ref=COVERSTORY

This is also an interesting site, where Robby talks about Detoxing from Church: http://www.robbymac.org/detox.html

I went to these links...I started reading Robby McAlpine's site and WOW! Now I know what I am! :D :D :D Post-Charismatic!!! :D :D :D I haven't read everything that he's written yet, but I read his first chapter and I'm now reading about the history. Thanks for sharing the link!!! He has put into words exactly how I feel!!! And it's great to know that there's others "out there" who feel the same way as I do.

love, newlife

P.S. I checked my library system's website and they own several copies of "Soul Survivor"...I plan to go pick up a copy of it today!!! Thanks, everyone, for the tips...

[Illuminated]

I will post a review when I am done.I just got this book, and have started reading it. I've read the preface so far. His account of an on-the-scene September 11th story has really affected me. :(

I dunno if I should read any more of it. Why on earth did he put that account in the book????

Have you finished reading it yet? What do you think of the rest of the book? Thanks.

Take what works :confused: and leave the rest.

[mary]

Hey, Newlife! Glad to see your post!!!!

Have you been on a sabbatical or have I just missed you lately? :confused: :rolleyes: Well, in any event I did miss you!

Love,

mary

[tke316]

I just got this book, and have started reading it. I've read the preface so far. His account of an on-the-scene September 11th story has really affected me. :(

I dunno if I should read any more of it. Why on earth did he put that account in the book????

Have you finished reading it yet? What do you think of the rest of the book? Thanks.

Take what works :confused: and leave the rest.

I am about half done with the book. I think it is great. I have had other people in my family read individual chapters and they seem to enjoy them too. :)

Unfortunately I had to turn in back into the library and now it has cycled through and I will be able to check it out again. :o

Our daughter is majoring in psychology and so I want her to read one chapter about the psychologist who is teaching literature. :cool:

[Scooter]

Profnachos,

I picked up the book when I was in college a couple of years ago, but I didn't get too far. Piling additional reading material on yourself in college effectively guarantees that you won't finish it. I've been wanting to pick it up again. There are so many good book recommendations on here...when will I get the time?!

[profnachos]

So far, I have enjoyed it. I do remember reading about 9-11, but can't remember his point for mentioning it.

But each chapter is pretty much self contained, which makes it easy to pick and and put down. I have read the chapters on Everett Koop and Martin Luther King so far because these are men that I was taught to distrust. Koop, they say, betrayed conservative Evangelicals once he got into his powerful position (which really wasn't), and Martin Luther King because he was a womanizer and Commnunist sympathizer.

The book challenges a lot of my assumptions. As I said before, Phillip Yancey was the single most important author who got me to give fundamentalism a second look.

[Carmen]

I'm not too keen on Yancey although I know that his books have helped some people. From reading his articles in Christianity Today, I find his theology to be wishy-washy and also find that he twists scripture in some astounding ways. Although he does rightfully point to some weaknesses in conservative fundamentalist Christianity, I find that following him directly could lead one from one fryingpan to another, if not necessarily into the fire.

Yancey is associated with mysticists at the end of this article:

http://www.inplainsite.org/html/mysticism.html

Biblical Discernment Ministries has a scathing article about Yancey. The article is too conservative for my taste, and too anti-liberal (I am somewhat liberal), but they do have some interesting information nevertheless. I try not to throw the baby out with the bathwater and get information wherever I can.

http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/exposes/yancey/yancey.htm

Incidentally BDM also has extensive information about John MacArthur.

http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/exposes/macarthur/
Especially http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/exposes/macarthur/general.htm the General Teachings section is interesting.

Biblical Discernment Ministries among others also associates Yancey with the Third Wave of the Holy Spirit movement, but I have found no direct evidence for this other than some association with Ted Haggard and numerous references to his books on Third Wave sites. Although friendships and coalitions can be telling, one is not automatically guilty by association, though it may give food for thought. Yancey lives in Evergreen, Co, within easy distance of Colorado Springs where Ted Haggard's World Prayer Center is and James Dobson's Focus on the Family is located. Haggard and a large association of churches in Colo. Springs are part of the Third Wave. I had enough of that while I still lived in that state. It is mystic and spiritually and mentally harmful.

Third Wave of the Holy Spirit definition here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Wave_of_the_Holy_Spirit

I'm running from the Third Wave, may it never catch me!

Apparently Larry Crabb, whose book I recently recommended with a few reservations, may be getting funny too. He is resident scholar at Colo. Christian Univ. at Morrison (near Denver) which is part of the National Association of Evangelicals (NAE President Ted Haggard).

Maybe this all means nothing and it will all look different tomorrow, maybe not.

Just take what you like and leave the rest, I'm not trying to offend or anything, just stating my opinion with a few warnings.

[profnachos]

Thank you for the links, Carmen.

I don't see him as a serious theologian, but a writer with very keen and thoughtful observations. And yes, I agree that we should never be "fans" of any Christian and vet everything he/she says against Scripture.

As to where he lives, Colorado now is the new epicenter of the Religious Right, and Yancey is far from being one. For decades, he lived in a slum in Chicago and learned a lot from having lived there.

I live in Orange County, CA and work just a few blocks from Rick Warren's Saddleback church. That really doesn't mean anything.

[Illuminated]

I live in Orange County, CA and work just a few blocks from Rick Warren's Saddleback church. That really doesn't mean anything.YES IT DOES!!!

Have you ever been to Saddleback church? If so, what was it like? If not, why doncha go and give us all a report?:D

[Illuminated]

I'm running from the Third Wave, may it never catch me! Maybe this all means nothing and it will all look different tomorrow, maybe not.
Thanks for the links! At last! Someone to run with me!!! Run away! Run away!

I've had my running shoes on for about 5 months now, and what I keep finding out makes me want to run even faster. I want to fight the good fight against the 3rd wave, run the race, and win!
Take what works :p and leave the rest!

[Carmen]

Crabb's loose connection to Haggard (In fact anyone's connection) gives me the willies. That kind of stuff is contagious if you listen to it long enough. "There is a way that seems right to a man, but in the end it leads to death." Prov. 14:12.

Could be that left and right want to fight it out in Colorado, but the bull**** no matter what side it comes from has been taking over for decades. I bumbled into and out of too many weird churches in the Denver area and that years ago, it must be worse now. Europe isn't immune from it either, England is full of it, but it seems to be spreading slower on the mainland. One Christian bookshop at Milan sells the books (though they know it is misleading, I confronted them with it, but they "have to make a living"). One other shop won't sell it and sticks to serious theological works, thank goodness.

Thanks for the links! At last! Someone to run with me!!! Run away! Run away!

I've had my running shoes on for about 5 months now, and what I keep finding out makes me want to run even faster. I want to fight the good fight against the 3rd wave, run the race, and win!
Take what works :p and leave the rest!


Race ya! :)

[hornblower]

Third Wave of the Holy Spirit definition here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Wave_of_the_Holy_Spirit

I'm running from the Third Wave, may it never catch me!

Ok I guess it caught me and i never even knew it until now.