September 1/01 - The Wasted Years?

[Reg]

Here is some more of my Journal entries I started sharing on the old forum.

September 1/01 - Beginning to Understand How Spiritual Abuse Has Affected Me -
The Wasted Years?

I have thought a lot about how my past has injured me emotionally and about that part of my life that was broken. Until I talked with Sue, I didn't realize I had a significant problem in that area. :confused:

That needed healing. I have subconsciously developed a coping mechanism that automatically kicks in (trigger) when certain people get close to me. I remain emotionally detached until I am convinced 101% I can trust them and they are safe. Any person in a position of authority, especially in a religious context, I am suspicious of. They need to, in my mind, be even more carefully scrutinized for me to feel safe with them & trust them. It's only time and experience getting to know them and their character that will cross that barrier in my mind.

Past relationships in the WCG have tainted my perception of people at BBC. I still have major trust issues to deal with because of these experiences. Some of my circle of friends I thought I could trust in the WCG & rely on shunned me when I left the WCG. Although we have shared many wonderful times while I was a member, it was not based on an authentic genuine relationship of friendship. It was not based on a personal level of love & respect who I was as a person & fellow Christian. It was based on who I was in relationship with the organization of the WCG, not the spiritual body of Christ.

As soon as I was outside the organization, those pseudo-relationships vanished. I was shunned & considered a troublemaker & even an enemy when I disagreed with the established leadership & some of the erroneous doctrine the WCG taught & adhered to. When I finally left, it was like I fell off the planet. After nearly 29 years in the WCG, having known well over a hundred people personally plus several close ties of friendship with those I considered friends, I received only one or two phone calls & NONE from the local ministers or church officials.

Today, the only significant relationships I have from all those years are with those who also left. They represent 3 of 4. Were all those years wasted? :(

[Oopsie Daisey]

WOW Reg, I can relate. Only all my relationships are affected because my parents done a number on me too! I am paralyzed in all relationships. Not only do I not trust and hold them at arms' length but I am lonely and starved for a relationship that I can't allow myself to have with anyone. My life is such a broken mess. Indeed are all those years wasted? Is today down the tubes again. Nothing short of a miracle will help me keep moving. Thanks for a post I can genuinely relate to.

[Emerging]

September 1/01 - Beginning to Understand How Spiritual Abuse Has Affected Me - Were all those years wasted?


Reg, you raise a great point - the years we've ALL lost because of the abuse ... were they "wasted"?

I suppose that is one way of looking at it, but what if we look at it another way ... that of those/these years being a very powerful witness of just why it is so awful for children to be assaulted. In fact, "whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea." So Jesus is saying it would be better for our attackers to have died than to have hurt us! Yet Jesus was the one who said "forgive one another as I have forgven you" ... Is this doublespeak on His part? No, imho it is just His way of telling the world how terribly destructive abuse against children is and why the consequences MUST be that severe .... and the sad emptiness that fills the lives of so many abuse survivors simply but amply witnesses for His wisdom.

And this ties into why I feel that *intent* is so key - sure there are many survivors in the world, .... but how many of them continue to perp ... and how many of us are working our hearts out trying to recover ... no matter how messy said recovery can be at times?

This is not to say things are rosy for me - they are not. I'm still struggling as I sit at work and watch all the emotional garbage, feeling like I'm back home re-immersed in that fake-love that I grew up with ... feeling like I'm finally learning how to survive, finally learning how to "make it work for me" ... finally "winning" .... but NOT ... although IF I was, at what price? Increasingly I feel my terror at trying to be free of it ... but I think that terror's been there all along, doing it's part of warning me that the "last time" I tried to escape, the outcome was far worse than if I'd not tried at all. And so I'm still at my soul-destroying job, tooo afraid to leave because "what if I do get a better job? Will they "see through me" and realize that I *deserve* no better than the abuse I grew up with?"

On the plus sice, I can see that that terror-filled voice cares for me and is trying to keep me safe with it's wisdom borne of immense heartache ... but I also see that that voice is from the past. That built-in protection was soooo needed then, when I was a tiny defenseless child, but now I'm a adult! I am big! I am strong! I can run!! I can tell my side and be heard! I can tell on my attackers and they will be stopped!! ... I CAN defend myself now! ... so I just need to make peace with this wounded voice from my past to be free from it's grip on me.

My counselor is amazing at being able to help me work through this stuff but I don't want to put any pressure on myself to heal at such and such a pace sooo I will just hope for the best, and that we can ALL be free of our wounded guardian voices just as quickly as possible.

Wasted? No, imho. A witness to sooo many that abuse against children is a SERIOUS crime, yes, and tells the world that it is HARD to recover from as a warning to others to chill out and be good with their own children. And we can help so many others throughout our lives by seeing them for the survivors they are and doing whatever we feel God wants us to do to help heal this world whenever possible.

[Florence]

I've thought so much about what you have written because it is so close to how I am on the whole issue of whether or not I can trust or know that I am safe. Initially, I couldn't "trust" any "religious" leaders, but, over time, I found that I was only concerned with the senior pastor of the church I now belong to. God knew I wouldn't be able to handle "church" stuff for awhile, so He put me in a position at a Bible college - surrounded by pastors and pastor-wanna-be's. It took about 5 years, but slowly, I grew to being able to view them as "normal" people just like me - not people who were out to get me or to find fault in me.

At the same time, the senior pastor of the church I had joined, appeared to be trying very hard to do everything right. He knew a small bit of my previous abusive experience and seemed to have all the right responses - grace, unconditional love and acceptance, support, encouragement, etc. While I never felt a need to "test" the people I worked with at the college, I do believe I have constantly tested the senior pastor of my church. I have watched him closely, pointedly questioned him on issues I felt were being handled poorly, and made clear that neither he nor I were perfect people.

Even when some things didn't go as they should have, he seemed so caring and concerned and used the excuse that he wasn't in control or responsible for the things his staff was doing that was borderline abusive to people. That was even his excuse when I was told a few weeks ago that I don't measure up and would have to reach the bar. He said he knew nothing of what was going on with the situation - he had left the matter of hiring for the position I had applied for completely in the hands of one young staffer - supposedly.

I feel that, as senior pastor and now CEO (new governmental structure implemented about a year ago made him CEO), he is completely responsible for those who are on his staff. I also believe that his staff - over the past year, 8 veteran, full-time staffers have quit and he has surrounded himself with young, inexperienced "yes-men" and "yes-women" who follow him around with drool running from the corners of their mouths - is simply carrying out his desires.

While he seemed so genuinely humble and servant-hearted when I first came to the church, I don't know if the years have changed him or if he was this way all along and was just very good at hiding it while he worked to move himself into such a place of power and position. I do know that this time, I am not suspicious of everyone in leadership in any church - after all, I work for a church and my senior-pastor-boss is definitely not a problem. I am only holding this one pastor responsible - he's the only one I truly feel is untrustworthy and unsafe.

Have all these years been wasted? No - because I understand God's grace and am very careful to extend it no strings attached - even to this guy and the one before him. Proof positive that there is a God.

[Reg]

Thanks Florence, Emerging and Oopsie for your replies and perspectives. I was away at the cottage for Canadian Thanksgiving when we traditionally have closed it. I'm just catching here.

I know God will not let any of our experiences go by without purpose. It just seems that I have had to make friends all over again at least three times.

I have a friend at our golf course that has introduced me to some of his friends that I golf with. At our last golfing vacation at his cottage I found out that he had been friends with a couple of them since he was 8 years old. They had so much history to share and could relate so well with one another. I envy them. There is so much of my life I cannot share or relate with to anyone. Most of what I do share is mostly current.


I am posting a followup to this one that I wrote the next day September 2 2001.
Intuition & Insight - INFJ

[Oopsie Daisey]

Thanks Florence, Emerging and Oopsie for your replies and perspectives. I was away at the cottage for Canadian Thanksgiving when we traditionally have closed it. I'm just catching here.

I know God will not let any of our experiences go by without purpose. It just seems that I have had to make friends all over again at least three times.

I have a friend at our golf course that has introduced me to some of his friends that I golf with. At our last golfing vacation at his cottage I found out that he had been friends with a couple of them since he was 8 years old. They had so much history to share and could relate so well with one another. I envy them. There is so much of my life I cannot share or relate with to anyone. Most of what I do share is mostly current.


I am posting a followup to this one that I wrote the next day September 2 2001.
Intuition & Insight - INFJ

Good share and it makes me envious that you are able to go on. I am glad you shared though.
I have become so hard and angry and today's devotional from NACR was so on target for where I am at...take my stony heart and turn it into flesh. I can't fathom ever trusting again to even try to form a relationship. How did you let it go? I mean how did you do it again and again? Once the church was gone that was it.

[Florence]

Reg.

Thanks so much. You have touched on the very things I need to work out in my own thoughts and heart.

I know exactly what you mean about friendships. I have one very long-term friend from college (over 20 years ago) who lives 4 hours away. We talk alot and see one another 4-6 times a year. She isn't a Christian, so she has an interesting perspective on my "church" experiences. She is probably the most "normal" of all of the people I have ever called "friend" because she hasn't been battered around or brain-washed by the church. She also is the most generous, loyal, loving person I know - what does that say for us Christians?

I have another semi-long-term friend - we are friends because we went through separate abusive churches at the same time and by the grace of God found each other. She moved to Michigan and then to Oklahoma within the past year and I rarely hear from her now. How I miss her.

And my nearest friend (outside my husband and my non-Christian parents and brothers) is also my keyboardist where I work. We met when I began attending the church I (we) belong to - she was the keyboardist there at the time - but we didn't become friends until I backed out of the music ministry at "our" church because of the music guy who was so "yuk". She had already quit working with him several months before. Neither of us realized that we had been black-balled, though she was probably more aware than I - and we both were very idealistic in that we clung to the belief that the senior pastor was true.

I wouldn't call ours a "normal" friendship, either. We work together, occasionally have lunch, and talk about church stuff - both at our church and where we work. We keep each other sane in some respects, but we also tend to focus only on the negative.

I often find myself wondering if I'm just such a terrible person that I have so few friends. Of course, all I do revolves around "church" because that's where I work, that's where I serve, and that's where my heart is. And then "church" turns out to be a place where people are the most judgemental and vindictive, instead of the most grace-full, loving, caring, accepting, and "friendly" people like it should be. Since our marriage, we have been members of 3 churches (not including the one where I work) and have left under difficult circumstances each time - taking no true friends with us. I wonder if I would find better "friends" if I got a job in a supermarket, frequented the casinos and bars, symphony concerts and art show? Or are people like this everywhere - fair-weather friends? Do any of us have more than 2 or 3 true friends? Or are we the weirdos?

[Oopsie Daisey]

Thank you for sharing your journal. It is odd how until I read your journal and posts that I really doubted being a subject of abuse until the forum. I always said that I felt like an abused wife but I never really had it quite this confirmed.

Your posts have shown me that some of the things that I have ran from and that I stare at daily are things that I will have to deal with and cannot run from and that is how I have internalized and taken ownership of all the problems that were a result of being mixed up with something not very healthy. It is hard to fathom a place considered so safe was actually the source of reinforcing that I was a nobody unless somebody wanted me to be. It is really hard to for me to come out of my denial and reckon that I truly don't have friends because they are not supposed to talk to me and they don't value the friendship enough to tell that mindset to blow off.

There are obvious jerks in leadership positions but the ones that are not so obvious are the most dangerous. I can see a big mouth and not personalize it but it is the one's who mouth all the right words and seem to have their stuff together that I shiver wondering is authentic or is it plastic.

I really never considered myself run by another's opinion of me but of course I never thought that a leader would do anything less than do what was expected out of them and that is lead with the Truth and lead with integrity. It is hard for me to admit that I am responsible for letting it go on as long as it did and not walking away.

Funny how I want to blame the leaders who are walking in deception and yet I, who should have been reading my Bible and was and praying and seeking God for myself could allow me to be the target of their misguided ideas of what leadership, God was all about.

Your post provokes me to take responsibility and not take the victim mentality that is so easy to take when your wounded and like anyone who is abused, you don't give up believing it will blow over and everything will be alright. Not a good excuse to stay in the ditch. I do need God's strength and guidance because I no longer trust that I discern so well in some things and especially where leaders are concerned.

Thanks again.

[Emerging]

Thank you for sharing your journal. It is odd how until I read your journal and posts that I really doubted being a subject of abuse until the forum. ... taken ownership of all the problems that were a result of being mixed up with something not very healthy. ....

There are obvious jerks in leadership positions but the ones that are not so obvious are the most dangerous. I can see a big mouth and not personalize it but it is the one's who mouth all the right words and seem to have their stuff together that I shiver wondering is authentic or is it plastic.

Funny how I want to blame the leaders who are walking in deception and yet I, who should have been reading my Bible and was and praying and seeking God for myself could allow me to be the target of their misguided ideas of what leadership, God was all about.

Your post provokes me to take responsibility and not take the victim mentality that is so easy to take when your wounded and like anyone who is abused, you don't give up believing it will blow over and everything will be alright. Not a good excuse to stay in the ditch. I do need God's strength and guidance because I no longer trust that I discern so well in some things and especially where leaders are concerned.

Thanks again.

(((Daisey))), ... AMEN SISTAH!!!! :eek: :rolleyes: :D

And OMIGOSH, have you been reading my journal??? No. of course not!! ... But we survivors sure do have the same responses to the abuse we've been put through, don't we?! ... Like, we get suckered into "taking ownership" of a lot of cr... umm... hooey, so then when self-help gurus tell us it's healthy to "own" our issues ... NO! MORE! OWNING! is my very adult and mature response. Yet it's what has to happen for us to heal and make amends as needed and then continue on in our lives... ... but I'm full up of owning and don't have any more room left to own!!! ... and that is where I gotta go through all my "stuff" and get rid of that hooey just a well as I can.

I, too, don't see the more subtle abusers so well at all. YET. With healing they are becoming more discernable, that's for sure ... but it takes time to heal and we just gotta let our selves heal ... sigh!! Want it done ... NOW!!! :rolleyes: :p

As for reading, welllll, I beg to differ because they twisted everything aorund so that we could not see the truth, not even when it was right there in black and white. So my experience was NO WAY I could see any different than they let me see ... because I was not then strong enough to walk away, alone, from all their darkness and deceptions.

Finally, I wonder if that's what I'm dealing with so much today - my own terribly hurting Heart. That which is supposed to guide us all safely and wisely Home.... is but a shattered remnant of it's true self due to all the abuse we've endured. It is SO terrified of being wrong, of getting in anyone's gunsites, of standing up for itself, of believing in anything good in life ... because it remembers nothing but one terrible disappointment after another. Yet, my children are NOT a disappointment. Nor are my true friends. Nor is the beauty of nature (ALWAYS a soul-healer for me!!).... perhaps my heart is battle-weary and needs to be gently and lovingly reminded that despite all the evil done to me and so many others, there IS still MUCH good out there ... just gotta be more open to it in my life. :)

Thank you ALL for such thought-provoking posts. Florence, these are weird times and maybe everyone else is as uncertain as we are, we're just ornery enough to admit and try to work past it? :confused: And Reg, I hope you had fun at The Cabin ... and know that just maybe, you can reconnect with old friends ... cuz I did this year! With a high-school friend who used to be one of my best friends of all ... and now as we get re-acquainted, there is something else wonderful to show my heart as proof that God is still Good, if only we are able see it.

[Oopsie Daisey]

[color=#ff3366](((Daisey))), ... AMEN SISTAH!!!! :eek: :rolleyes: :

I, too, don't see the more subtle abusers so well at all. YET. With healing they are becoming more discernable, that's for sure ... but it takes time to heal and we just gotta let our selves heal ... sigh!! Want it done ... NOW!!! :rolleyes: :p

As for reading, welllll, I beg to differ because they twisted everything aorund so that we could not see the truth, not even when it was right there in black and white. So my experience was NO WAY I could see any different than they let me see ... because I was not then strong enough to walk away, alone, from all their darkness and deceptions.

Finally, I wonder if that's what I'm dealing with so much today - my own terribly hurting Heart. That which is supposed to guide us all safely and wisely Home.... is but a shattered remnant of it's true self due to all the abuse we've endured. It is SO terrified of being wrong, of getting in anyone's gunsites, of standing up for itself, of believing in anything good in life ... because it remembers nothing but one terrible disappointment after another. Yet, my children are NOT a disappointment. Nor are my true friends. Nor is the beauty of nature (ALWAYS a soul-healer for me!!).... perhaps my heart is battle-weary and needs to be gently and lovingly reminded that despite all the evil done to me and so many others, there IS still MUCH good out there ... just gotta be more open to it in my life. :)

COLOR]

Emerging:

My heart was deeply touched as you related to this so well and funny when you said that about the reading and As for reading, welllll, I beg to differ because they twisted everything aorund so that we could not see the truth, not even when it was right there in black and white. So my experience was NO WAY I could see any different than they let me see ... because I was not then strong enough to walk away, alone, from all their darkness and deceptions. I read this then I thought you know I needed challenged here because this is one of those spots that I do the self blame thing and really rag on myself for it thinking I should have known better and hanging myself. You know in so many ways I feel fortunate because when I first went to my ex-church they had the truth and it was taught, broke down and it was carefully give and then it was later in the 15 years of attendance that I realized it was being twisted and it was called a "New revelation" to the scripture or "Word of God" funny how I have a bigger revelation now to even what my foundation was built on.... I am glad you posted because I did second guess myself on the reading after I posted. But I blew it off and then when you posted I knew that was not something I should shelve anymore.

Thanks for sharing.

So sorry that you hurt. I wished I could just make or help people feel better.

It hurts to be hurt and to see others hurt just for something so pure as the Gospel and wanting to be a Christian in the truest form.

Melanie

[Reg]

Here's a follow up...

Just read this article. Very Good.

Let Nothing Be Wasted
http://www.spiritualabuse.org/articles/wasted.html

[justasiam]

Whoa....pretty heavy stuff...thank you for sharing..defianately needed:cool: It is amazing God's timing..and in such a gentle way..defianately not what am use too ....the emotions are so strong at times..healing?? the tears seem endless..a new chapter beginning for me..relating to so much shared.

[Malinda]

I'm struggling now with those same issues of trust. My husband and I just attended the "partners" meeting at our new church and it was just a little weird for me.
As I sat filling out their questionaire and information sheet I was struck with fear that they'd look into my background. I filled out the part with all my previous ministry experience but couldn't bring myself to put down the church where I'd ministered. They asked what was your last home church and instead of answering the question truthfully, I put the last church that we'd been checking out. In truth we were only at that church maybe two months.
I obsessed over it the whole way home.
It scares me to have to explain to this new pastor the truth about the abuse I suffered. Especially because I think one of his staff members might know my SA pastors personally.
This new pastor has this stance that you can't minister if you're offended and hurt by the church. I'm a little afraid that I'll be rejected later on down the road. I have all these God given talents and to be barred from using them would just hurt terribly, all because someone else abused me.
I too have struggled with the wasted years issue...but I finally came to realise that I now have a greater capacity to minister to others. That, and I would have never become a worship leader if I had not been given that chance at my SA church. I became a worship leader while at that church, attended Bible College, had my marriage restored and learned I was a gifted teacher and speaker. So there were some definite positives. I also learned what a Pastor is not. I've also learned more about God's grace in these last 9 months than any other time in my christian walk, and I've been through a lot.
My only regret is that I had had the guts to walk out and quit the day my SA pastors stole from me the choice to have another baby while employed with them. I wish I had been strong enough to confront them and to have gotten up, walked out, cleaned out my office, and quit.

[Reg]

I'm struggling now with those same issues of trust. My husband and I just attended the "partners" meeting at our new church and it was just a little weird for me.
As I sat filling out their questionaire and information sheet I was struck with fear that they'd look into my background. I filled out the part with all my previous ministry experience but couldn't bring myself to put down the church where I'd ministered. They asked what was your last home church and instead of answering the question truthfully, I put the last church that we'd been checking out. In truth we were only at that church maybe two months.
I obsessed over it the whole way home.
It scares me to have to explain to this new pastor the truth about the abuse I suffered. Especially because I think one of his staff members might know my SA pastors personally.
This new pastor has this stance that you can't minister if you're offended and hurt by the church. I'm a little afraid that I'll be rejected later on down the road. I have all these God given talents and to be barred from using them would just hurt terribly, all because someone else abused me.
I too have struggled with the wasted years issue...but I finally came to realise that I now have a greater capacity to minister to others. That, and I would have never become a worship leader if I had not been given that chance at my SA church. I became a worship leader while at that church, attended Bible College, had my marriage restored and learned I was a gifted teacher and speaker. So there were some definite positives. I also learned what a Pastor is not. I've also learned more about God's grace in these last 9 months than any other time in my christian walk, and I've been through a lot.
My only regret is that I had had the guts to walk out and quit the day my SA pastors stole from me the choice to have another baby while employed with them. I wish I had been strong enough to confront them and to have gotten up, walked out, cleaned out my office, and quit.
Malinda,

You mirror some of my exact thoughts and experiences when I started attending my present church. I felt tainted from being a member of what they considered a Bible Cult. I didn't want anyone to know. I thought I would be looked on as someone who had somewhat of a questionable background.

When I considered being a member and attended their new member class, my baptism was brought into question. I was interviewed by three elders concerning this. I was determined NOT to be rebaptized. If they insisted on this I would withdraw my application to be a member. Rejection was definitely on my mind. Despite that, I would not cave in and allow another church control me to do something I felt was wrong.

After the three interviews they were convinced my baptism was legit. The chairman of the board of elders apologized later questioning my baptism. If I wasn't 100% determined in my mind NOT to be baptized again I may have allowed them to rebaptize me. If they insisted, I most likely would have left that church. No way would I allow another church control me by coercion or peer pressure. Thankfully, I found a grace filled body of believers.

One more thing. If it wasn't for one special person (the senior pastor's wife who asked me if I wanted to be a part of the Evangelism team) I might not have even agreed to meet with the elders. She played a significant part in my healing and regaining some of my trust in church leaders. I discovered that there are authentic Christian leaders I could trust again.

The part I underlined above would be a concern of mine. I would wonder why he thought that way. What made him take that stance?

[Malinda]

Reg,
I have the same concern as well but I don't think you can really understand spiritual abuse until you've been through it. There's hurt by the church and then there's abused by the church.
I know that in the WOF circles it's commonly taught that those who leave a church offended will bounce from church to church and these types of people, because of their baggage and constant offence, aren't useful to minister to others. They have no longevity or stability.
He mentioned in the class that at some point in time he'll offend us and if you've left offended at another church you'll be probably leave their church offended.
I'm not certain but I think my Pastor may have come from a saddleback or gateway linked church. From what I know He came from a big church in California.
I do know that he calls Bishop Jim Bolin from Trinity chapel his spiritual Father. This concerns me as well. Jim Bolin was removed from his position as Senior Pastor because of inappropriate sexual bahavior. (I look up every guest speaker before I listen to them. That's how I found this out.)
So, I think he's been exposed to the same kind of teaching. It's funny how we just reiterate things we've learned without actually thinking things through. I'm hoping that's the case here because then he can be taught something else by experience rather than just reiterated learning.
I am willing to give my new Pastors the benefit of the doubt but there's definitely a red flag there.
I'm dying to ask questions but I don't want to expose myself in the process.
I also want to know if this one staff member really knows my SA pastors or not. If he's the guy that my SA pastors used to talk about, it sure wasn't good. Not that I believe a word my SA pastors have to say.
I have a lot of questions but I'm too scared to find the answers.

[Reg]

Malinda,

I understand your reluctance to ask questions and expose yourself.

I checked out this Bolin guy. Here is one comment in the article I read...

Cobb pastor steps down for ‘inappropriate behavior’
Son speaks to congregation of Trinity Chapel Church of God

By KAY POWELL

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

Thursday, December 11, 2008

Comments:
nonya Austell, GA
#2
Dec 12, 2008

Touch not mine annointed...Pastor Bolin has won thousands of souls to Jesus. He is still a man of God and as a member of Trinity, I will continue to lift he and his family up in prayer. He is human just like we all are. I think that it is important at this time to continue in the work that he has started and pray that God covers our congregation. Let he who is without sin cast the first stone..... be careful people...God is still God now and forevermore.

--------

When I hear things like, "Touch not mine annointed" it drives me crazy how brainwashed these people are. They don't understand what that really means and SA Pastors, etc. have used this as an excuse to continue in their ways without any accountability and justice being served for what they have done.

Terms like ‘inappropriate behavior’ sort of whitewash what they have been guilty of doing. When Jesus confronted the Pharisees, He didn't mince words.

To understand what "Touch not mine annointed" really means we have discussed this here......

“Touch not thy anointed”
http://www.christianrecovery.com/vb/showthread.php?t=6194&highlight=Touch+anointed

Personally, I would keep those red flags flying. For this Pastor to say that Bolin was his spiritual father, I would be very leery of him.

[Malinda]

This week I sent my new Pastor two book suggestions: "Soul Repair" and "The subtle power of spiritual abuse." So we'll see how the reaction is.
He had mentioned during the partners meeting that the majority of the church has grown through salvation but those that have transplanted from other churches, the majority have been hurt by another church or minister. So I sent him these book suggestions so he could better minister to those in that group. It seems my town has a plethora of abusive ministers. One of my close friends just quit at a church as their music minister and she's going through a lot of the same gossip crap that I had gone through at my SA church. When I was there I saw some of the same characteristics and patterns for abuse. She turned in her notice and the true colors started shining through. I feel terrible for her since she has already been through a very abusive situation at the last church she had been at.
I do wish there was a way to get the answers I need before I get too involved. I'd hate to have to find another church as I the whole family likes it.
This pastor seems to be very genuine in his walk with the Lord, a very down to earth guy. There's no stuffy suit, or power positioning that I've seen. But I've only been there a few months.
I'm at that point of, I could make it or break for a run.
So we'll just see if he says anything to me this morning at church. We'll see if I started a ball rolling or not.
The red flags are still flying.

[Reg]

Just reviewed this and wondered Malinda how did it go with the new pastor and new church? Did he get those books and read them.

Hope you are still here reading.

[beingme]

I feel like I have a lot of wasted years, wasted work, etc. My husband begs to differ and say we did all those things for God but I'm not so sure. Some of those things we did out of fear and had nothing to with God. Anyway, I'm interested in this - Intuition & Insight - INFJ - it seemed like there was a link but there wasn't.
I'm an INFJ so it would be interesting to me.

[Reg]

As you may know, I'm also an INFJ.

Here's an Portrait of an INFJ
http://www.personalitypage.com/INFJ.html

[beingme]

Thanks. I thought there was a link to something from you about the abuse and INFJ but it didn't link? Maybe I was wrong.

[Reg]

It was only info re INFJ. Not a personal one.