Where do we go from here?

[Joseph]

Where Do We Go From Here?

This has been on my mind alot in the last year and after I read ProfNachos post about “Ex-Fundamentalists” I figured it was time I sounded off. ProfNachos is correct in his assessment of this situation, as it is right now, we really don’t have anywhere to go unless we suck it up, compromise our values, look the other way, and fit in somewhere. If you think about it, church really has become more about the people then about God. If everyone focused on seeking God there would be a lot less problems right? Instead they are essentially moving away from Gods values and inserting their own. Okay, know that I’ve stated the obvious, where do we go from here? I’m tired of feeling like were lurking in the shadows, we haven’t done anything wrong. I also long for some real fellowship again, but only with Christians that are on the same page, let me rephrase that, I’d be happy as long as we’re in the same book, preferably the NKJV. I believe, we need to start getting together with other Christians (that are close to us) who have been through this same thing and start planting seeds, a harvest will come. The way we are thinking is correct according to the Bible and we are going to have to come out of the closet at one point and pave a new road, perhaps start small prayer groups that would contact world wide prayer groups that would connect together via the internet. There are people that are not so strong that haven’t gotten out that need our help, we really need to figure out the best way to assist them with their struggle too. We need to go about our business and spread the Gospel like Jesus wants us too, we need to move forward, God has lead through the desert for a reason, he is expecting us to stand up for Him. I figure it’s the least I can do with all things he’s come to my aid for (too many to list).
It’s time to get the bullwhip out, go into the Temple and kick over some tables.

I am really enjoying all my new relationships on this sight, a lot of you have really nice web pages getting your message out, we need more of that.

Joe

[SpinningHead]

I think you have a great attitude and I certainly share that attitude, or rather it's more accurate to say that I had that attitude gung-ho when I first realized what happened to me. Then put it on the back burner when I realized I have a long way to go before I can act on that attitude.

Speaking for myself...I need to stay "here" a while. I came here to lick my wounds and regain some sense of myself and refocus. While I can't understand all that happened to us or understand why it happened...I have to gain my own ground. I'm not ready to walk out in the world all big & strong yet because I have a lot of healing to do. I'd be nervous of doing someone else damage right now b/c of my skeptic and cinicism. I've got some me & God work to do before I take on the "man".

I'm not ready to go to church.
I'm not ready to join a Bible study.
I'm not ready to really engage w/ other Christians (b/c the ones I have engaged w/ are all programmed to tell me I have to forgive and it's all up to me and I have to be in church...I can't hear that message again right now. I can't even be around my mother that much for reasons I posted on another thread...)
I have to find my compassion and loose my defenses.
I'm hurt! I'm wounded! It's all very dramatic right now...I've never been in this place before...

Being here on this forum is a life line to me. You're all such a step for me. What happened to me did not happen overnight and my healing isn't going to happen overnight either. I've got a lot of renewing of the mind to go.

I don't want to discourage anyone else from doing anything, really...just sharing in a safe place.

[Joseph]

Just so everyone understands, I know everybody is in different places and I totally understand. We're all different, I guess I want to see what you think. Like other things we talk about, we think to ourselves and don't have the opportunity to express how we think until we have a forum to do it on like this.

Joe

[Willow]

Hi Joe,

This is from a totally different angle, but kinda the same too. One of the experiences that was most freeing to me was to be part of a bible study group that involved people so wildly different that it would seem we shouldn't be sitting together in one room. I learned from a nonjudgemental environment about other people's experiences, viewpoints, orientations... etc. Some of them were nearly more than I could handle. I was so afraid of "different". The thing we all had in common was our disappointment in the church and the abuse we had suffered at its hands. It led me on a path that was very different than I had been on. I had been seeking people who were as much like me as possible in their belief systems. Lately, I'm more interested in experiencing new environments that would have threatened me before. My tolerance level is getting really big and I feel bigger because of it. Unfortunately, the only thing I haven't been able to tolerate is a church service :( I've tried several times at several different kinds of churches... still it's all very triggering to me. Oh well... one step at a time. I may find what I'm looking for outside of the church anyway... I mean... Jesus did, didn't he?

Hope this isn't too off the wall. I kinda wrote off the top of my head from my recent growth experiences.

[Joseph]

Hi Willow,

That is probably the biggest stumbling block for me also, church services, half way through the service I'm looking for the door. I've tried about 6 or 7 different churches, I just can't get myself to submit.

Joe

[jane]

Joe,

maybe you're not supposed to submit to what you are hearing from the pulpit.

jane

[jane]

let me expound on that a little further....

In my opinion, the new testament talks about submitting one to another- laying down our lives for each other.

It talks about not calling anyone Rabbi or Father....

Even an angel when bowed down to, tells a mere man to stand and give honor only to God.

I believe that our modern church has gone awry. We call leaders Pastor, we give that title esteem that is not seen in the new testament churches-

then we are trained to submit to authority.

I don't see that in the new testament, I see the opposite.

I see Jesus telling us to be careful of false teachers that would led us astray, even the elect, if it were possible....

I see him questionning the things of the religious leaders that don't ring true and I see him telling us to test the teachings/teachers that we sit under.

If you can't submit, maybe their is a Good / God reason why you can't.....and shouldn't.

jane

[jane]

oh, and Paul was a tentmaker, not wanting to be a financial burden to his church. The money went to the needs of the widows and the poor (alms).

so, where is it written that we give gifts to the annointed one (our pastor).. to levels of worship!


jane

[profnachos]

Thanks Joseph. You expressed the sentiment very eloquently.

My new year's resolution for 2005 was to find a church home. I tried to suck it up, and tried to make my way in while holding my nose. But the stench was just too overwhelming.


Where Do We Go From Here?

This has been on my mind alot in the last year and after I read ProfNachos post about “Ex-Fundamentalists” I figured it was time I sounded off. ProfNachos is correct in his assessment of this situation, as it is right now, we really don’t have anywhere to go unless we suck it up, compromise our values, look the other way, and fit in somewhere. If you think about it, church really has become more about the people then about God. If everyone focused on seeking God there would be a lot less problems right? Instead they are essentially moving away from Gods values and inserting their own. Okay, know that I’ve stated the obvious, where do we go from here? I’m tired of feeling like were lurking in the shadows, we haven’t done anything wrong. I also long for some real fellowship again, but only with Christians that are on the same page, let me rephrase that, I’d be happy as long as we’re in the same book, preferably the NKJV. I believe, we need to start getting together with other Christians (that are close to us) who have been through this same thing and start planting seeds, a harvest will come. The way we are thinking is correct according to the Bible and we are going to have to come out of the closet at one point and pave a new road, perhaps start small prayer groups that would contact world wide prayer groups that would connect together via the internet. There are people that are not so strong that haven’t gotten out that need our help, we really need to figure out the best way to assist them with their struggle too. We need to go about our business and spread the Gospel like Jesus wants us too, we need to move forward, God has lead through the desert for a reason, he is expecting us to stand up for Him. I figure it’s the least I can do with all things he’s come to my aid for (too many to list).
It’s time to get the bullwhip out, go into the Temple and kick over some tables.

I am really enjoying all my new relationships on this sight, a lot of you have really nice web pages getting your message out, we need more of that.

Joe

[Willow]

Jane, I'm like you in believing there is something ominously wrong with the entire organized church. There are some quaker groups that I've considered visiting because their authority structure is nothing like the modern church. Their services are said to be on an equalateral authority level. There are 2 branches of the modern quakers. One is more liberal and one is more bible-oriented. The quakers near me are of the more liberal slant. I never have visited... but admit I have been curious.

Not sure, but Joe and Prof... this might be an option for you all to check out. http://www.quaker.org/

[Willow]

Hey... I also found a quaker info forum :)

http://www.quakerinfo.com/forum/

[truth]

Spinning Head speaks for me....

it's so hard.....and you want the fellowship of like-minded Christians....but my husband and I are prayiing constantly regarding new fellowship, churches etc and really nothing seems to show itself....

I have even tried to go to a couple of churches, a small prayer group - it just doesn't work for me anymore and it triggers alot of the old experiences and memories to come back....

So for now, I am just committed to the healing process and appropriately in God's timing moving on....

truth

[truth]

Spinning Head speaks for me....

it's so hard.....and you want the fellowship of like-minded Christians....but my husband and I are prayiing constantly regarding new fellowship, churches etc and really nothing seems to show itself....

I have even tried to go to a couple of churches, a small prayer group - it just doesn't work for me anymore and it triggers alot of the old experiences and memories to come back....

So for now, I am just committed to the healing process and appropriately in God's timing moving on....

truth

[SpinningHead]

Spinning Head speaks for me....

Truth, you have to stay away from my mother too?? ;)

Recognizing that you need some time for yourself to gain perspective and get some of your attitudes more aligned with who you want to be in life (and who God wants you to be in life), IMHO is a huge first step in self care. Like putting the oxygen mask on yourself before you can help someone else with theirs.

I think it's great to be in a place or want to be in that place that says, "So where to we go from here?"...but like I said, I just got "here" and need to be "here" a while. :) And that's ok...

IF I were to go somewhere from "here"...I think I would go to a big mega church where I can be anonymous. However, there is no such thing as mega churches in New England. We live in the land of Cheers...everybody knows your name.

[truth]

SpinningHead -

I don't think that I care if my church is big or small (although I prefer big) I want "healthy" that's all.....recovery - oriented....

I think that the problem of the last church was that we were drawn there by the praise and worship, the great people we met in the congregation - close proximity to our home, cultural-racial diversity - great kid's programs - yet with all that said - the theology was toxic and from the first day I met him, I never ever liked the senior pastor or agreed with many of his messages.....weird huh? comprimise....

but it taught me, no matter how I tried to avoid him, force myself to love him, no matter what - it couldn't be avoided that HE was the driving force behind that church and HIS THEOLOGY AND BELIEFS(not Jesus) affected everything......

so - the next church I would pay more attention to what my instincts were telling me and not ignore them like I did here! I would have more faith to believe that I wouldn't need to comprimise because God would have the right place for me!

and yeah, SpinningHead, I have to stay away from your mother too! how do you put put with that woman??!!!!!:D

truth

[Carmen]

Be careful with the Quakers. I am not sure about the liberals, but I think the others have sect-like tendencies from what I have read on them. It may be interesting, will take a look at the liberal site.

[Willow]

Thanks for the heads-up. From what I can tell the liberals are VERY liberal. More like a unitarian church, but less head-oriented and more spirit-oriented. I was more drawn to the conservatives... but sure don't want to fall into another trap. There aren't any quakers near me anyway though... so not much danger.