~~~Counterproductive~~~

[Oopsie Daisey]

I am impressed to say this. I didn't post yesterday and arrived at the site today to see a post in response to something I posted about a week ago. I will not engage in a doctrinal conversation. To me it is counterproductive and the other day I seen a post because someone dared to have a difference in opinion some one was accused of not being a Christian. That made me sad. This would be no different than the church abuse and if that kind of conversation continues, it is counterproductive to leaving the spiritual abuse behind in the churches we left. I couldn't help but feel sad about the situation but I can't fix it. I have never considered anyone anything but a Christian here unless they state differently. We all come from diverse backgrounds and different foundations and for myself it is counterproductive to look at the board and see that someone is accusing or alluding that your belief system isn't right? That to me was counter productive to do it and have it done to and watch it be done to someone else. The way the other person said " Your not a Christian are you? to one of the other members here took a lot of restraint on my part and to shut my mouth and not defend until I had thought about it. I have thought about it and consider it very rude and counter productive. That is the kind of abuse that got left behind was someone always undermining. That is not healthy interaction on a Spiritual abuse forum.

And if you take shame from reading this post. That is your problem not mine. I am not trying to shame anyone either.

It is a sad thing when we have nothing better to do than pick on each other's post. If that is the way it is then we might just as well go back to where we got criticized to begin with.

God bless and I am taking a break.

Melanie

[Boo]

Hi Oopsie,

You were saying:

[...]We all come from diverse backgrounds and different foundations and for myself it is counterproductive to look at the board and see that someone is accusing or alluding that your belief system isn't right? That to me was counter productive to do it and have it done to and watch it be done to someone else. The way the other person said " Your not a Christian are you? to one of the other members here took a lot of restraint on my part and to shut my mouth and not defend until I had thought about it.[...]

I saw that comment as well Oopsie. As you know, I think I'm the only one here currently that has said that I'm not sure I can call myself a Christian anymore. (And you know, I was saying to a friend recently, in all fairness, maybe I shouldn't be here anymore. It is a Christian recovery forum & perhaps my participation is very limited & for sure, anything I'd have to say may not be taken seriously since I'm such a tossed about doubter right now. As far as I know or have seen here, other's here are confident in their Christian stance.

The thing is, theology &/or doctrines have always IMO & experiences, been a part of the spiritual abuse equation. For example, in my ex-church we were taught we were the one true church. No one else was saved. No one in any of the other countless churches in town were saved. This didn't make sense to me then & it still doesn't. I know countless dedicated & believing Christians from all kinds of denominations (inside & outside the church), yet, to the leadership of our ex-church...nope, those "Christians" weren't saved...they were deceived by the "evil" one, etc. No need to go into it here as I know everyone here must know what I mean & have experienced it themselves in their own spiritual abuse stories.

It has been my experience that questioning someone's faith like that only shuts the door to further dialogue & I agree, it is counter-productive. It's one thing if we ourselves openly question our own Christianity, it is quite another when someone else does it.

[Boo]

Hi Oopsie,

You were saying:

[...]We all come from diverse backgrounds and different foundations and for myself it is counterproductive to look at the board and see that someone is accusing or alluding that your belief system isn't right? That to me was counter productive to do it and have it done to and watch it be done to someone else. The way the other person said " Your not a Christian are you? to one of the other members here took a lot of restraint on my part and to shut my mouth and not defend until I had thought about it.[...]

I saw that comment as well Oopsie. As you know, I think I'm the only one here currently that has said that I'm not sure I can call myself a Christian anymore. (And you know, I was saying to a friend recently, in all fairness, maybe I shouldn't be here anymore. It is a Christian recovery forum & perhaps my participation is very limited & for sure, anything I'd have to say may not be taken seriously since I'm such a tossed about doubter right now. As far as I know or have seen here, other's here are confident in their Christian stance.

The thing is, theology &/or doctrines have always IMO & experiences, been a part of the spiritual abuse equation. For example, in my ex-church we were taught we were the one true church. No one else was saved. No one in any of the other countless churches in town were saved. This didn't make sense to me then & it still doesn't. I know countless dedicated & believing Christians from all kinds of denominations (inside & outside the church), yet, to the leadership of our ex-church...nope, those "Christians" weren't saved...they were deceived by the "evil" one, etc. No need to go into it here as I know everyone here must know what I mean & have experienced it themselves in their own spiritual abuse stories.

It has been my experience that questioning someone's faith like that only shuts the door to further dialogue & I agree, it is counter-productive. It's one thing if we ourselves openly question our own Christianity, it is quite another when someone else does it.




P.S. In case you all are just wondering, the comment I am referring to is on The Hurricane & God threads. Florence it was your comment that I am referring to. It does appear to me as though you are questioning Emerging's Christianity, though perhaps your comment is directed elsewhere? Please correct me if I'm wrong.

[Oopsie Daisey]

Hi Oopsie,

You were saying:

[...]We all come from diverse backgrounds and different foundations and for myself it is counterproductive to look at the board and see that someone is accusing or alluding that your belief system isn't right? That to me was counter productive to do it and have it done to and watch it be done to someone else. The way the other person said " Your not a Christian are you? to one of the other members here took a lot of restraint on my part and to shut my mouth and not defend until I had thought about it.[...]

I saw that comment as well Oopsie. As you know, I think I'm the only one here currently that has said that I'm not sure I can call myself a Christian anymore. (And you know, I was saying to a friend recently, in all fairness, maybe I shouldn't be here anymore. It is a Christian recovery forum & perhaps my participation is very limited & for sure, anything I'd have to say may not be taken seriously since I'm such a tossed about doubter right now. As far as I know or have seen here, other's here are confident in their Christian stance.

The thing is, theology &/or doctrines have always IMO & experiences, been a part of the spiritual abuse equation. For example, in my ex-church we were taught we were the one true church. No one else was saved. No one in any of the other countless churches in town were saved. This didn't make sense to me then & it still doesn't. I know countless dedicated & believing Christians from all kinds of denominations (inside & outside the church), yet, to the leadership of our ex-church...nope, those "Christians" weren't saved...they were deceived by the "evil" one, etc. No need to go into it here as I know everyone here must know what I mean & have experienced it themselves in their own spiritual abuse stories.

It has been my experience that questioning someone's faith like that only shuts the door to further dialogue & I agree, it is counter-productive. It's one thing if we ourselves openly question our own Christianity, it is quite another when someone else does it.



Dear Boo:

I was going to take a break for a few days because I thought I was going to get a good report at the doctor and I was going to go do things. Well that didn't happen and so I would like to comment on your post. Did you know that I seriously question the condition of my heart? Salvation? As well as what you. Although, not raised in a church who thought we were the one "true" church, I went into a setting where we were the only ones that had the truth and most everyone else was decieved.

I appreciate your sharing and speaking up as it is evident by your post you understand very well what it would mean to the person who has gone through abuses. I am an abuser as well as having been abused and I understand what would provoke a statement like that but it does not necessarily mean that it is acceptable on a forum where people are healing from spiritual play on words/meanings/and slams and other various forms of abuses.

Boo, I hope you will find out you like it here and stick around because your posts indicate a person who is on a journey and wondering what God is all about in their own life for themselves after a journey of being told what it is suppose to be for you. Maybe finding out what your belief's are and why? and what next? I can totally relate if that is what you are experiencing. I want to assure you that hearing what you have shared assures me more than ever, I want to rub shoulders with you because your the person who is going to relate to me and not be a religious idiot who has all the answers. You know where you came from and you have demonstrated to me that you are on the same journey as the majority of us ...finding our way after the church.

Boo, I could just hug you for sharing because what you said was good stuff. Thanks. What you have to say is very important and I am sure I will learn from you. Please do not hesitate to share on that account. I am sure others will gain as well and hopefully you will gain from us as well.

Thanks for the great post.

Oopsie Daisey

[Florence]

Just to clarify - I wasn't condemning anyone for not being a Christian or being condeming or attempting to be counterproductive. Quite the opposite. Not everyone who has been spiritually abused had it happen in a Christian setting, so to have two people (or several people) dialoguing on a theological topic in which definitions are based on dis-similar belief systems only leads to more and more misunderstandings - which is where I felt the dialogue was going.

Even people within Christian systems have huge discrepancies within their theologies - like a Calvinist and an Armenian. So, to understand where a person is coming from and how they define their terms is critical to understanding. I did feel that some of the viewpoints expressed were so far from anything that I have ever encountered within any Christian belief system that it probably indicated something other than a Christian view. By asking the question, I gave the person the opportunity to help me better understand where they were coming from. If there is Christian teaching out there reflecting those view points, I would like to educate myself on them. If the view points are from another belief system, it would help to know in order to better understand.

I apologize for not phrasing the question in a less offensive way. I had just learned of a death in the family and was not taking a great deal of time to formulate my question. My bad. Please forgive.

[Oopsie Daisey]

Please continue to keep posting Florence and let me get to know you better and your style and you. I want to know you better. Please keep sharing.

Oopsie Daisey.

Thanks for the clarification.

[Boo]

Just to clarify - I wasn't condemning anyone for not being a Christian or being condeming or attempting to be counterproductive. Quite the opposite. Not everyone who has been spiritually abused had it happen in a Christian setting, so to have two people (or several people) dialoguing on a theological topic in which definitions are based on dis-similar belief systems only leads to more and more misunderstandings - which is where I felt the dialogue was going.

Even people within Christian systems have huge discrepancies within their theologies - like a Calvinist and an Armenian. So, to understand where a person is coming from and how they define their terms is critical to understanding. I did feel that some of the viewpoints expressed were so far from anything that I have ever encountered within any Christian belief system that it probably indicated something other than a Christian view. By asking the question, I gave the person the opportunity to help me better understand where they were coming from. If there is Christian teaching out there reflecting those view points, I would like to educate myself on them. If the view points are from another belief system, it would help to know in order to better understand.

I apologize for not phrasing the question in a less offensive way. I had just learned of a death in the family and was not taking a great deal of time to formulate my question. My bad. Please forgive.
Thank you Florence for the clarification. I very much appreciate it.